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#734289 - 07/24/08 06:05 AM
Long Term Clonazepam use ok?
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LocalFarmer
Banned. Using PM's to solicit for own site/scam pacificnorthwestonly.com - Not approved or introduced as rep
Member
Registered: 05/06/08
Posts: 175
Loc: PNW
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Hello all I have a question regarding a recent exchange with my Dr.
I have been prescribed 1mg clonazepam at night for sleep/anxiety and my refills just ran out. So i requested a refill from my Dr. and he told me he doesnt want me to take Clonazepam because you will become "dependent" and need higher and higher doses. (I understand where he's coming from)
BUT...I have read up and in the journal of psychopharmocology (or something) it says that their is no downside to taking clonazepam long term.
My Dr's "answer" is to keep putting me on different SSRI's which are supposed to "treat anxiety" but actually only increase anxiety, along with 10 other horrible side effects.
Clonazepam seems to have been working great for me (it was prescribed by a different Dr. out of state who works at a world famous hospital and understands my rare condition much better) and now my local Dr. wont refill the prescription. What should I do?
A. Argue with my local Dr.
B. Have my other Dr. (out of state) prescribe me what I need
C. Buy through IOP/NROP and say screw you Doctors.
Mind you this is the same Dr. who prescribed me Effexor and it made me feel insane, nightmares, sweating, increased anxiety. How is that a good alternative to clonazepam which has had no side effects and have not had to increase dosage?
Please tell me what to do. I have a follow up Dr. appt and I'm thinking of just saying screw it and saving the 300 bucks it costs to talk to this "dr." for 15 minutes.
What do you think. Thanks
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#734301 - 07/24/08 06:25 AM
Re: Long Term Clonazepam use ok?
[Re: LocalFarmer]
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Oxy80
GRAND Pooh-Bah
Registered: 03/30/08
Posts: 1655
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The one downside to non stop taking Clonazepam is addiction. It's not uncommon for a Dr. to treat patients like this, I don't personally agree with it but its common practise.
All I can think of that you can do is find another Dr.
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#734306 - 07/24/08 06:34 AM
Re: Long Term Clonazepam use ok?
[Re: Oxy80]
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LocalFarmer
Banned. Using PM's to solicit for own site/scam pacificnorthwestonly.com - Not approved or introduced as rep
Member
Registered: 05/06/08
Posts: 175
Loc: PNW
|
Well like I said, I have "another Dr." in a neighboring state who is a specialist in my rare condition. He was the one who prescribed me the clonazepam in the first place.
If i'm not mistaken I can simply bypass my stupid local Dr. and just work with the specialist out of state? Because my health care actually covered my prescription from the out of state Dr. but they dont cover the visits to either Dr. 300-400 a visit. So if my specialist Dr. has me covered why do I need to even see a "Psyciatrist/Expert on meds" who obviously knows less than your average reader of this forum in the way drugs affect people differently.
Thanks for the help. Appreciate it.
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#734340 - 07/24/08 07:27 AM
Re: Long Term Clonazepam use ok?
[Re: JokerOwling]
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LocalFarmer
Banned. Using PM's to solicit for own site/scam pacificnorthwestonly.com - Not approved or introduced as rep
Member
Registered: 05/06/08
Posts: 175
Loc: PNW
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How is being on an SSRI that you cannot go off of because of the withdrawl effects not an "addiction"
Why are SSRI's the answer, and all benzos are evil and addictive? Every SSRI I've ever taken made me feel like constipated psychopath, with no positive effects.
I think I finnaly understand this rigid mentality of Dr's who don't know jack. For example my current Dr. didnt even believe my condition existed, he thought I was making it up. Thank god for specialists that understand!
Edited by LocalFarmer (07/24/08 07:31 AM)
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#734344 - 07/24/08 07:30 AM
Re: Long Term Clonazepam use ok?
[Re: LocalFarmer]
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Oxy80
GRAND Pooh-Bah
Registered: 03/30/08
Posts: 1655
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Well, they say SSRI meds are NOT addictive while Benzos are addictive. Some Doctors are on one side of the fence, the rest are on another.
My Doctors are ok with Benzos, so the Dr. you use makes all the difference in the world.
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#734349 - 07/24/08 07:38 AM
Re: Long Term Clonazepam use ok?
[Re: Oxy80]
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RNB007
Veteran
Registered: 04/16/08
Posts: 500
Loc: SE US
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Well, they say SSRI meds are NOT addictive while Benzos are addictive. Some Doctors are on one side of the fence, the rest are on another.
My Doctors are ok with Benzos, so the Dr. you use makes all the difference in the world.
Some people who take Paxil have heroin like withdraw symptoms..Even though Paxil did me no good I stayed on it for over a year and I quit cold turkey since I was told its NON addicting. I also belonged to a web group online who had the same problem so some SSRI's can cause withdraw...I thought I was going insane until I goggled Paxil withdraw then I was like WOW this is real...RNB
_________________________
When you do nothing, you feel powerless. But when you get involved, you feel the sense of hope from knowing you are working to make things better.
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#734362 - 07/24/08 07:48 AM
Re: Long Term Clonazepam use ok?
[Re: elgatoloco]
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LocalFarmer
Banned. Using PM's to solicit for own site/scam pacificnorthwestonly.com - Not approved or introduced as rep
Member
Registered: 05/06/08
Posts: 175
Loc: PNW
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The reason I LIKE the clonazepam though is for the anti anxiety effects that seem to 1. Put me to sleep, and 2. Help my anxiety the next day
I really dont have sleep problems, the great anti anxiety effects are the reason i would like to continue taking it.
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#734373 - 07/24/08 08:00 AM
Re: Long Term Clonazepam use ok?
[Re: LocalFarmer]
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nephro
GRAND Pooh-Bah
Registered: 09/04/06
Posts: 8570
Loc: UK, despite the rumours
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Has he not suggested a tricyclic antidepressant? SSRIs don't tend to sedate much in some patients but amitriptyline or a relative is almost guaranteed to help you sleep. There are side-effects, but at a low dose these aren't generally too troublesome and they do lessen.
The difference between the 'addictive' nature of benzodiazepines and antidepressants is that antidepressants have no reinforcing properties; benzos fetch money on the street whilst antidepressants certainly don't.
The other advantage to amitriptyline and its relatives is that tolerance to the sedative effects almost never occurs. If you start on a low dose and work upwards to whatever helps you sleep best you'll minimise unwanted effects. Dry mouth is probably the most irritating; increased appetite can bother some people, especially when taken during the day for depression.
You'd be killing 2 birds with 1 stone since the tricyclics can help with anxiety too.
Unlike the antidepressant effect, amitriptyline's hypnotic effects are immediate. It can even be used on an occasional basis for insomnia, though it won't be much use as an antidepressant when used like that.
The sedating tricyclics include amitriptyline, clomipramine, dosulepin (dothiepin), doxepin, mianserin, trazodone, and trimipramine.
I'd be surprised if one of them didn't suit you, and you can always change.
Having said all this, there is currently a change in guidance in prescribing certain tricyclics. Amitriptyline has fallen out of favour due to high rates of fatalities in overdose, so you may wish to see what the situation is in your country.
Trazodone has the sedative effects of amitriptyline, but has less side-effects, and may be an option to discuss with your doctor. Similarly with mianserin, but blood counts have to be performed initially.
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#734381 - 07/24/08 08:11 AM
Re: Long Term Clonazepam use ok?
[Re: nephro]
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LocalFarmer
Banned. Using PM's to solicit for own site/scam pacificnorthwestonly.com - Not approved or introduced as rep
Member
Registered: 05/06/08
Posts: 175
Loc: PNW
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I don't need a sleeping pill, or a depression pill, I need a longterm anti anxiety pill.
Thats all. Nothing more.
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#734471 - 07/24/08 09:52 AM
Re: Long Term Clonazepam use ok?
[Re: nephro]
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LocalFarmer
Banned. Using PM's to solicit for own site/scam pacificnorthwestonly.com - Not approved or introduced as rep
Member
Registered: 05/06/08
Posts: 175
Loc: PNW
|
I don't need a sleeping pill, or a depression pill, I need a longterm anti anxiety pill.
Thats all. Nothing more. You initially said you were prescribed clonazepam for anxiety/sleep. The benzodiazepines are not indicated for long-term anxiety, so that's why your doctor wants you off them. SSRIs are indicated for long-term anxiety, so that's why he's pushing you towards those. For initial anxiety during SSRI induction, he can prescribe a benzodiazepine on a short-term basis.
SSRI's are "indicated" for long term anxiety but only cause me more anxiety. I have been reading about people who have been on Clonazepam 1mg for years with no downsides , as well as medical studies showing no negatives of long term clonazepam use..why is this not acceptable? Why is this not a valid form of treatment? Why MUST YOU TAKE AN SSRI? I really dont get it because SSRI's are some of the most addictive thigns out there, once your on them, if you miss a dose you feel like you want to die. Clonazepam is a long acting Benzo, completely different than taking Xanax to feel good for a few hours. I seriously believe my specialist Dr. (at one of the top hospitals in the US) who prescribed me 1mg a day clonazepam knew what he was talking about and had no problem prescribing that long term. Its only my local Dr. who wouldnt refill the scrip thats making it an issue.
Oh and by the way the Clonazepam was for Sleep/Anxiety because I take it before bed and that puts me to sleep (not that I needed it) but it really is the best time to take it for getting it in your system for when you wake up the next day and have no anxiety. (for me morning anxiety is always the worst)
Just for the record. Everyone is different, I have tried 4 SSRI's now. So far they have been EVIL, nothing but terrible effects. I know they really help some people here. So i'm just saying everyones different. What works for me might not work for you and vice versa.
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#734691 - 07/24/08 01:20 PM
Re: Long Term Clonazepam use ok?
[Re: LocalFarmer]
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nephro
GRAND Pooh-Bah
Registered: 09/04/06
Posts: 8570
Loc: UK, despite the rumours
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The reason is that although some studies suggest long-term benzodiazepine may not cause addiction/dependence, the vast majority of evidence suggests they do. So the medical world remains unconvinced regarding long-term use, rightly or wrongly.
This means that any doctor who prescribes long-term is leaving himself open to being sued if the patient becomes dependent, so one has to see it from their point of view.
Regarding why it has to be an SSRI, this is because they have no reinforcing properties and so are termed non-addictive. You have to give each one several weeks before evaluating their effectiveness, unfortunately.
Someone posted this video of someone who suddenly stopped clonazepam:
http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?doci...QLi2snPCw&hl=en
Apparently there were follow-ups and he recovered but I haven't seen them.
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#734754 - 07/24/08 02:13 PM
Re: Long Term Clonazepam use ok?
[Re: LocalFarmer]
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martind
Veteran
Registered: 05/01/08
Posts: 671
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I don't need a sleeping pill, or a depression pill, I need a longterm anti anxiety pill.
Thats all. Nothing more. You initially said you were prescribed clonazepam for anxiety/sleep. The benzodiazepines are not indicated for long-term anxiety, so that's why your doctor wants you off them. SSRIs are indicated for long-term anxiety, so that's why he's pushing you towards those. For initial anxiety during SSRI induction, he can prescribe a benzodiazepine on a short-term basis. SSRI's are "indicated" for long term anxiety but only cause me more anxiety. I have been reading about people who have been on Clonazepam 1mg for years with no downsides , as well as medical studies showing no negatives of long term clonazepam use..why is this not acceptable? Why is this not a valid form of treatment? Why MUST YOU TAKE AN SSRI? I really dont get it because SSRI's are some of the most addictive thigns out there, once your on them, if you miss a dose you feel like you want to die. Clonazepam is a long acting Benzo, completely different than taking Xanax to feel good for a few hours. I seriously believe my specialist Dr. (at one of the top hospitals in the US) who prescribed me 1mg a day clonazepam knew what he was talking about and had no problem prescribing that long term. Its only my local Dr. who wouldnt refill the scrip thats making it an issue. Oh and by the way the Clonazepam was for Sleep/Anxiety because I take it before bed and that puts me to sleep (not that I needed it) but it really is the best time to take it for getting it in your system for when you wake up the next day and have no anxiety. (for me morning anxiety is always the worst) Just for the record. Everyone is different, I have tried 4 SSRI's now. So far they have been EVIL, nothing but terrible effects. I know they really help some people here. So i'm just saying everyones different. What works for me might not work for you and vice versa.
It sounds like you are confusing "addiction" and "withdrawal syndrome." The discontinuation of a medication abruptly such as a SSRI can cause a series of negative reactions which are symptoms of withdrawal.
Addiction is a whole nother set of circumstances. The behaviors associated with addiction involve negative impacts on the addict's life which he ignores in pursuit of the drug of his choice. Despite the negative consequences, he continues to abuse the drug.
Even with meds such as Lisinopril a withdrawal syndrome can occur. But I've never seen patients on it or SSRI's constantly increasing their dose or jonesing for them, or, when necessary, trying to buy them illegally somehow.
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