 |
 |
 |
 |
#200295 - 07/23/05 08:57 AM
Re: Cymbalta - duloxetine hydrochloride
|
Trampy
GRAND Pooh-Bah
Registered: 04/02/02
Posts: 3178
Loc: Southwest U.S.
|
If the doctor says he doesn't know how to discontinue Cymbalta, sue him for malpractice or just find a psychiatrist who has a clue. The only doctors who should be using Cymabalta are highly experienced psychiatrists who have exhausted many other options and are doing close monitoring. Your shrink is a moron. Suicidal and homicidal thoughts happen so much with Cymbalta because it can cause what they call a "mixed state" where the person is very depressed and very agitated at the same time. It's that agitation that makes some people act out in anger or frustration.
http://www.prozactruth.com/cymbalta.htm
Don't try a multi-day Cymbalta taper on your own. Heavy benzos are usually required. PLEASE tell your husband to stop taking it right now or drop down to just 10 mg for today by emptying a capsule ... and get to a hospital ASAP. If you tell them that the Cymbalta is making him suicidal, their first qustion should be "does he need an ambulance?"
First call around the major hospitals and find one with an outpatient psychiatric unit, hopefully one where that shrink does not have privileges (ASK!).
It could save his life. If he's in a really bad state, he might have to be detoxed from Cymbalta as an in-patient where they could keep him from hurting self or others. Those records would support you in any future malpractice lawsuit.
He will likely need to be sedated with benzos until the Cymbalta wears off. Sometimes hospitalization is required. Very large benzo doses may be required and that's why they might want to hospitalize him.
If the FDA pulled Serzone, Cymabalta's idiopathic neuropathy labeling is criminally negligent. If Lilly fudged the safety data, their execs could go to prison for it.
Your husband should be treated for his pain with a pain killer, not the most dangerous antidepressant on the market.
Forget local lawyers and your husband talking to lawyers might only make him more ill. If you find a hospital or another psychiatrist, talk to them first and only let your husband talk to them after you've explained the situation.
Look for national lawyers who are working on class-action lawsuits against Lilly for this drug. There have been murders and suicides from it much more common than from Prozac.
Most large hospitals have very good training for their psychiatric staff. Some of them have Urgent Care facilities open on the weekend with psychiatrists or psychiatric nurse parctitioners available. It would probably be better for him than waiting till Monday.
Even if it's out of network on your insurance, you can get it covered if they write it up as a psychiatric emergency, which it soulds like. It's not his fault. Keep telling him that!
Since it's the weekend now you might have to take him to an ER. If you do, take him to a hospital with a good psychiatric unit because they should have decent psychiatrists on call. Don't let them admit him unless they convince you it's really necessary because psychiatric hospitals can be damaging in and of themselves.
Forget about that Cymbalta shrink unless you're going to be suing him! Most states give you three years to sue.
KEEP TELLING HIM THAT IT'S NOT HIS FAULT AND THAT HE CAN GET RELIEF AS SOON AS THEY SEE HIM IN TRIAGE.
Edited by Trampy (07/23/05 10:03 AM)
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
 |
 |
 |
 |
|
|
|
|
|
#200296 - 07/23/05 09:13 AM
Re: Cymbalta - duloxetine hydrochloride
|
sincity
GRAND Pooh-Bah
Registered: 06/07/03
Posts: 2461
|
Quote:
I've read that Cymbalta is the latest greatest thing for depression and pain because it works on two different receptors. My doctor says patients swear by it, but it's really expensive for those of us without rx coverage.
Well Eli Lilly is telling that to anyone who will listen, and pain doc's are handing out this stuff like candy and have no clue as to what the repercussions of this dangerous drug are. My dad was given a script of cymbalta for his diabetic neuropathy, he took it for about a week, and couldn't figure out why he was feeling so down and depressed. Luckily, I arrived at his home, saw what he was taking, and immediately had him taper down, and threw the rest down the toilet.
This is a dangerous drug, been there, done that, and DO NOT let any pain doc, or regular old MD tell you different. My advice is stay away from Cymbalta.
_________________________
You shall not bear false witness against your neighbour...
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
#200298 - 07/23/05 10:39 AM
Re: Cymbalta - duloxetine hydrochloride
|
warthogg
Stranger
Registered: 03/11/05
Posts: 10
Loc: TX
|
This is the Husband writing.
Well, it is good to finally hear somebody who understands. I want to ask how it is that you know and how well you understand the effects of Cymbalta for the following reasons.
Before I took Cymbalta I did not know what extreme and deep depression and psychosis was like. In fact I am writing this because I was so impressed with the depth of it that I realize that no person alive can truly understand it unless they have experienced it. It is a strangeness so bad that when it takes me I truly wish that I could exchange it for severe physical pain. It is a torment so deep, so irrational that physical pain would be preferable. In fact words cannot truly convey a darkness and depression so deep that it actually feels physical.
Anyway, I am sure that a reading of the above description can in no way convey the reality behind it. From what experience do you type your previous message to my wife? You seem, at least, to grasp the realness of the situation.
The good news is that I am an extremely stable and normal person. The only time that I experience this horror is when I miss a dose of Cymbalta. It is about 48 hours after a dose that the dark thoughts set in. By the way the prescribing doctor told me that for Cymbalta to be effective against neuropathy, which is why it was prescribed to me, that I need to take twice the dose in which it was normally prescribed for its original use. So I take 60 mg. per day instead of 30.
Because I have a full months worth of Cymbalta on hand, the only immediate danger for me is that I forget to take a dose, which has been the percipitatant of my previous experiences.
I do not want this to wreck my career and my home. I have a family dependant on me. How do I find the resources to deal with this, how do I find others who know what is going on. I am enraged that Lilly can push such a drug for neuropathy. I agree that it should only be used as a drug of last resort. As far as I am concerned it is useful as an alternative to death only.
Anyway, I live in tremendous fear of the experience and the darkness. I have this fear thanks to Lilly and a doctor who sees him self as a ground breaker. A savior of diabetics. Enough said.
Please direct my wife to any resources that you are aware of which will help her to see what it is that I truly face.
I have told my wife, although I do not know that she can understand, that I feel that my life is now only as long as my last prescription of Cymbalta. For now I am normal but I live under a constant shadow and a memory of horror. Horror is not just a word.
Thank you for the understanding words.
Tom
An after thought: Depression is not the lone effect of missing a dose of Cymbalta, it seems more like a psychosis, an irrational state that feels and seems rational. That is to say that horrible things seem to make sense. It is a very bad place to be.
Edited by warthogg (07/23/05 11:34 AM)
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
#200300 - 07/23/05 12:32 PM
Re: Cymbalta - duloxetine hydrochloride
|
bunnycat
Banned: Kratom vendor in disguise
Registered: 07/12/05
Posts: 1703
Loc: on the Dark Side of the Moon
|
I personally do not have any use for those SSRI's, especially this Cymbalta . The doc tried to give that to me one time, stating that this would help my pain, what horsesh!t! What about emotional pain? Anti-depressants might help some people for pain and an anxiety, but I suspect is is only prescribed to help the pharmaceutical companies make money and to help the doc find a non-narcotic alternative to having to prescribe something useful, in fear of losing that precious DEA license. I question all doctors ethical and personal concern when they choose to resort to such drugs to either help drug companies make money, or cover their own *ss about script-writing for scheduled drugs. Every SSRI I have ever taken, and I have tried almost all of them on the market have either made feel suicidal, homicidal, or both . I have even gotten into trouble with the law while on them, though that may or may not have been the reason why. My advice is to steer clear of all of them, unless you can get documented proof that they are needed, and I am not sure if that is even possible. One thing to remember is, if you go to the hospital and tell them you are feeling suicidal, with or without the usage of SSRI's, bring a suitcase and plan on staying because they aren't going to let you leave for awhile, with or without your consent. According to law, they have to keep you for a few days to assess your mental condition. 
_________________________
"Admin edited out the Kratom sources I was trying to promote with my posts"
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
#200304 - 07/23/05 07:51 PM
Re: Cymbalta - duloxetine hydrochloride
|
NVR2L8
Member
Registered: 03/12/05
Posts: 114
Loc: TX
|
Okay, i have been tapering from cymbalta for 1 week now from 30mgs. This is my first day without it at all. I feel weird, as i did coming off of Effexor (i believe the 2 are from the same family). I feel dizzy everytime i move. I think i have experienced every single emotion there is possibly to feel everyday since tapering and coming off of this stuff. I was/am taking it for anxiety. My eye sight is messed up as well. I cannot focus.
Now, as far as suicide. I guess yes I have thought about it but, i guess, in passing. I am not sure if any of you have tripped on acid in the past, but, that is what i feel like right now. I TOLD the doc, "if i am gonna come off of this med, you ARE gonna give me some xanax to help with the withdrawals!!!" and he did and it does help.
I feel better without the drug, well being wise so far.
I believe these drugs serve their purpose but, i wish that the medical community would learn more about how to put people on these meds and help them get off of them as well as about the side effects. They seem to know jack about any of it.
These drugs mess with our brains people. It cannot be good. I can feel the brain zaps and the vertigo and it is horrible. I was suicidal coming off of Effexor but Cymbalta has not proved to be as bad as that. I will be out of commission for a bit though.
I just keep telling myself that it will pass, and it will.
I did not like or know, however, like what was posted about the seizures. I had no clue of this.
Good luck to all.
Me.
_________________________
"When I have to choose between two evils, I pick the one Ive never tried." ~~ Mae West
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
#200305 - 07/23/05 08:57 PM
Re: Cymbalta - duloxetine hydrochloride
|
signal
Journeyman
Registered: 03/16/04
Posts: 68
|
SSRI's did save my life and i'll say it to anyone....it's like the guy above said, you _can't_ understand depression until you've been there. there really is no way to describe it, and mine was _not_ brought on by any kind of drug use---the ssri's made me feel normal for the first time since my early teens. sure there are problems and some major ones as well---also, scarily enough, it seems like some doctors aren't any more educated about the drugs than i am---or that i know even more about them, and all the possible horror stories, from my internet research (I didn't get on anything until I had thoroughly read up on it). anyway, tom said it best. there's just no way to describe what he calls "black thoughts." and for those of us whose brains are wired, or became wired, so that we experience that as our natural state, being restored to normalcy is a godsend---my life is completely different now and i just can't say that enough.
Edited by signal (07/23/05 08:58 PM)
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
#200306 - 07/23/05 09:13 PM
Re: Cymbalta - duloxetine hydrochloride
|
Trampy
GRAND Pooh-Bah
Registered: 04/02/02
Posts: 3178
Loc: Southwest U.S.
|
Quote:
.. Show me the clinical evidence that SSRI's are as bad as you say they are.
Ready? Bombs Away!
Most of the SSRIs are not approved for Major Depressive Disorder (MDD). Go look that up at FDA/CDER. Cymbalta is an SSNRI that is approved for MDD, but it's the most deadly of the bunch. See:
http://www.antidepressantsfacts.com/duloxetine-cymbalta.htm
http://www.psycom.net/depression.central.ssri-suicide.html
http://www.pc.gov.au/study/medicaltechnology/subs/subpr047.pdf
http://forum.drugs.md/index.php/board-27_action-display_threadid-194
Do a Google and PubMed to search for other work by Lucinda Lucire, Ph.D. Forensic Psychiatrist:
http://members.ozemail.com.au/~lucire/documents/pps/Do_SSRIs_cause_Suicide.ppt
Prozac, Zoloft, and Paxil are often helpful for mild mood disorders, but they (and Cymbalta) cause suicide for those with Major Depressive Disorder (MDD), those with Bipolar I and II, and among children. It's a fact. Read the Black Box:
http://www.fda.gov/cder/drug/antidepressants/SSRIlabelChange.htm
Do a Google for David Healy and read his books.
Most of these drugs are dispensed by PCPs who would be clueless to do a differential diagnosis to rule out MDD and Bipolar II per DSM-IV-TR. Forget about BiPolar I where they're clearly contraindicated. Without a conjunctive strong mood stabilizer like lithium carbonate, causing harm with the off-label use of the SSRIs and SSNRIs with BiPolar disease could lead to multi-million-dollar malpractice awards.
As long a doctor used a drug per the FDA label in good faith and proper monitoring, he or she is judgement proof. But any off-label uses are at their risk and peril (and their patient's).
Drug companies have settled many lawsuits from suicides and homicides that were caused by these drugs, sometimes by their abrupt discontinuation ... often due to terrifying side effects such as described by the diabetic neuropathic Husband above. He feels psychotic, suicidal, and profoundly depressed when he stops taking Cymbalta.
And why was Traci Johnson the first suicide in Lilly's monitored research facility in its entire 78-year history when she was an in-patient?!?!? She was totally healthy until Lilly gave her high-dose Cymbalta and then discontinued it. That suicide was due to their negligence and Lilly practically admitted it by settling with the family so quickly. So think about what it could do to someone with MDD or someone with BiPolar II given it by a PCP doctor who might not even have the DSM-IV-TR on his bookshelf, much less understand how to do a DSM differential diagnosis.
If your PCP put you on Cymbalta and you experience ANY adverse effects, get thee to psychiatric urgent care ASAP and bring extra keys, cell phone, etc., in case you are admitted for detox. Try to find a friend to go with you.
If it stays on the market, it should have a Black Box saying it's for use only by Board Certified psychiatrists who will provide close monitoring and have access to psychiatric hospital facilities for high-dose-benzo Cymbalta detoxes if needed.
Lilly is marketing the most dangerous anti-depressant in the world for idiopathic diabetic neuropathy to use in people who have no mental disease whatsoever. Is that a crime, or what?
The most scary thing about these drugs is that they cause suicide and homicide even among "mentally healthy" people.
If you know people who benefited from any of these poisons, God Bless them. They're lucky. Can any of them have sex?
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| |
