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#944951 - 10/16/09 08:49 PM Liquid OC and Morphine
KLynn Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 04/19/06
Posts: 90
I ask that you please forgive my ignorance, as I have absolutely no experience with these types of meds.

I am hoping to understand the how liquid OC and Morphine compares to their tablet forms. Is it the same, weaker, or stronger? I assume it would be immediate since it is taken orally, but am not sure.

I have never heard of the liquid forms of these meds and can find little information online about them. Does anyone have any experience with either of these meds in liquid form?

Thank you very much for your time.

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#945011 - 10/16/09 10:49 PM Re: Liquid OC and Morphine [Re: KLynn]
nephro Offline
GRAND Pooh-Bah

Registered: 09/04/06
Posts: 9716
Loc: NOT 40!
Well there is no such thing as liquid OxyContin, though there is liquid oxycodone. 60mg liquid morphine = 60mg tablet morphine. 20mg liquid oxycodone = 20mg tablet oxycodone. There is no difference in strength between the same drug in tablet or liquid form.

The liquid usually acts faster, though it is certainly not immediate, and is useful in patients who have difficulty taking tablets.

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#945042 - 10/16/09 11:42 PM Re: Liquid OC and Morphine [Re: nephro]
KLynn Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 04/19/06
Posts: 90
Thanks so much for the helpful info.

Is the oxycodone a stronger pain med than morphine?

I have only had morphine once (by a pump) after having a C-Section. Morphine made me feel like I was burning alive from the inside out and I literally scratched all skin off my nose.
It was a horrible experience, to say the least.

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#945111 - 10/17/09 02:11 AM Re: Liquid OC and Morphine [Re: KLynn]
Milvus Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 09/13/07
Posts: 264
Loc: the depths of East Asia
My understanding is that parenterally oxycodone and morphine are about the same strength, but taken orally oxycodone is twice as potent, due to higer oral bioavailability (around 75%).

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#945159 - 10/17/09 06:43 AM Re: Liquid OC and Morphine [Re: Milvus]
Lynx4 Offline
Threadhead

Registered: 08/08/07
Posts: 804
The only time I've seen liquid Morphine was when my Dad was dying. He had less than a week to live and wanted to die at home, so a home nurse came over everyday and gave him huge bottles of morphine. It didn't kill the pain, but it did put him to sleep often so that he at least didn't feel the pain.

I don't think you can get the liquid in the US unless you are terminal with a very short amount of time left. Everyone else would get the pill form.

And yeah, oxycodone has a higher bioability so he probably should have been given that, but maybe it wasn't an option at the time (around 15 years go), since he didn't have an IV and maybe it has to be taken via IV. I don't know.

Oxycodone makes me feel hot from the inside out and I actually sweat doing even small things. Hydrocodone doesn't do that, although it causes a lot of heartburn. I guess you have to pick your poison.

When Dad died he was only given Morphine. When my father in law died he was hooked to an IV at home and his wife shown how to administer his medicines. They had to keep a book that so that he didn't overdose, as he was taking liquid narcotics, narcotics through an IV, Fentanyl(which the nurse changed every 2 days), and several other narcotics. But he was in so much pain that he could only stay awake an hour or two a day and in the end didn't know where he was or what was going on. He wife had to okay pulling the plug, as he was technically still alive, but totally inchoherent and in a heck of a lot of pain, regardless of what they gave him.

So, I would think that liquid morphine or liquid oxycodone would be reserved for terminal patients and people in so much pain that they could possibly die from the pain alone.

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#945196 - 10/17/09 09:42 AM Re: Liquid OC and Morphine [Re: Lynx4]
nephro Offline
GRAND Pooh-Bah

Registered: 09/04/06
Posts: 9716
Loc: NOT 40!
The strengths mg/mg are of little importance unless they are being given by SC infusion, and maybe other reasons why a small dose volume is important.

No matter how much oxycodone you give someone, one could match it with morphine even if it means giving more (and vice versa), since both drugs have no ceiling effect.

What can be of importance is the occasional patient who experiences worsening pain with a particular opioid. We don't know exactly why this happens, but if it does, then the patient should be rescued with a different one.

I have a problem with morphine and renal colic, for example, as it makes the pain many times worse, but the drug kills my gout pain pretty well if I take enough.

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#945218 - 10/17/09 10:52 AM Re: Liquid OC and Morphine [Re: nephro]
Milvus Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 09/13/07
Posts: 264
Loc: the depths of East Asia
Do you find pethidine better for renal colic, Nephro?

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#945250 - 10/17/09 12:23 PM Re: Liquid OC and Morphine [Re: Milvus]
nephro Offline
GRAND Pooh-Bah

Registered: 09/04/06
Posts: 9716
Loc: NOT 40!
Like magic. Such a pity the drug is so short-acting and toxic when given repeatedly.

They have debunked the myth that it works by relaxing smooth muscle, but instead it seems to have a local anaesthetic effect. One of its other chemical names, isonipecaine, suggests this by the "caine" at the end if it.

I wish I could have just one ampoule on hand in case of another attack, just to get me to hospital, but it seems impossible to get.

It didn't help that one doctor gave me 3 x 10mg IVs of morphine within an hour, despite it making it worse every time. As soon as a consultant saw me, he knew what was happening and rescued me with pethidine. He said that he always uses pethidine as the drug of choice for renal colic.

I didn't complain about the first doctor because he was a nice chap and was doing his best for me, even though the pain caused was just unbelievable. It probably wasn't his fault that he hadn't been trained to recognise this issue with renal colic and morphine, and 3 x 10mg IV morphine was very generous of him in the space of one hour.

Some doctors would have given diclofenac and waited an hour "to give it chance to work". It is so cruel to treat acute pain like that. Give the IV opioid and THEN give the NSAID. Get the patient out of pain. It's not difficult.


Edited by nephro (10/17/09 12:32 PM)

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#945625 - 10/18/09 03:16 AM Re: Liquid OC and Morphine [Re: zeny28]
wofer Offline
Threadhead

Registered: 07/11/08
Posts: 804
Loc: Between a Rock and a Hardplace...
tried giving you freindly advice. oh well.
_________________________
A fool is a 27 story window-washer who steps back to admire his work.

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#945670 - 10/18/09 07:31 AM Re: Liquid OC and Morphine [Re: wofer]
DeeRock Online   sick
Old Hand

Registered: 07/11/06
Posts: 419
Loc: St. Louis
I have no experience with liquid morphine, except for the pain pump I had when in the hospital for car wreck.

but I've had the yellow (its almost like mountain dew, only not as green) liquid oxycodone (I think brand name is oxydose)

I know it comes in 5mg/ml and 20mg/ml. it comes in a bottle with a dropper that has measurments on the side. I think you're supposed to squirt it into orange juice or some kind of juice. or held under the tongue, but its gross tasting. it is immediate release so it can feel stronger than a 20mg oxycontin.

hope this helps you at least half the way cause like I said I have no experience with the liquid morphine.
_________________________
All I ever wanted was to pick apart the day,
put the pieces back together my way.

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#946227 - 10/19/09 01:13 PM Re: Liquid OC and Morphine [Re: DeeRock]
tucson Offline
Stranger

Registered: 06/08/09
Posts: 20
After my brain surgery, I had the oxydose or oxyfast. What a wonder drug. I could become truly addicted to that medication.
It works and it works fast.

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#946255 - 10/19/09 01:56 PM Re: Liquid OC and Morphine [Re: tucson]
nephro Offline
GRAND Pooh-Bah

Registered: 09/04/06
Posts: 9716
Loc: NOT 40!
It will be interesting to see how, and why if it does, oxycodone use develops in the UK. It's only been on the market a couple of years, and I believe it is a lot more reliable orally than morphine.

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