I plan to go and hope to receive the same medications I was on for the last year plus. I know there is a new Doctor in the house, but do not know his name and probably won't post it anyway. But I will post my experience and opinion and PM anyone who wants with specifics. I'll be able to report back next week.

I just don't like the way everyone on here is worried about "the law". Lets be honest here... the reason most of us are on here is because the current laws have us in a situation that has made our life less than enjoyable. A doctor that plays it safe and cowers to the DEA is not your advocate and you sure don't need to come here to find one of those. Look in the phone book. Most of us are looking for a Doctor with the balls to treat us for what we need, give us meds sufficient to make a difference, and see us again next month. Dr. Gatell did that and that is why the "authorities" had problems with him. Screw the authorities and the nanny state that they perpetuate. I want to be treated so I can have the quality of life I think I deserve with a treatment I agree on. If some of you don't like the price, the procedure, the drug, the quirks or whatever - just leave and go somewhere else. As long as I agree I am not getting ripped off. And if I don't agree, nobody can make me.

Where was everyone worried about proper procedure and protocol and morals when the NROP's were thriving and when the online pharmacies were doing phone consults? They were in front of there computers ordering. So come on people - get off the soap box. Lets help each other find relief, not criticize the people who provide it. It's still your money and you only have to spend it when you want to. And I don't mean this as a personal attack on anyone - just a reality check.

Here is to a pain free and happy life for us all!

i don't know if you were specifically replying to me, but as I was saying I did not think it was a big deal and believed that he probably knew about it anyway. It was probably his decision. And as long as my script was right and he knew it, then I would never have had a problem with it.

painstaking,
I was only referring to you in that I would report my experience because I know you and at least one other person is interested in knowing. The rest was just blowing off steam at a couple of the posts where the posters are so righteously concerned about the legalities of things.

birdtruck

Birdtuck very well said!

Very nicely put BIRDTUCK!! I've been thinking about that for years!! We need to help eachother just find that pain relief and not sit and critize!! I just wish we all could get on the band wagon and fight for this change the laws.. I mean it seems like there startin to be a lot more lax with the marijuanna laws I wonder if it would filter down and they'll start being a little bit better with pain medication.. It'd be nice!!

You bet it would be nice. I wish there were some activist groups that had some clout that we could all join. It would be worth getting involved and even donating to. I know there are some small groups advocating for pain relief rights, but I don't think they carry much weight. If anyone knows, please share.
My appointment is this next week and I am hoping for the best.
But we do really need to stop being judgmental with other members here. Just be honest about why we are all here. We get enough criticism and judgment from useless doctors and pharmacists who think their allegiance is to the DEA or local Sheriff instead of the customer who pays their salary. I hope everyone finds the relief they need and if we are in a position to help one another we ought to.

Bird... you have an appt with Dr Gatell next week? I would be curious how that goes and how his new office is.
Thanks

Dr Gatell saved my life!!!
After 20+ years of pain following a cerebral aneurysm (described as migraines by neuros), and most recently after 7 months with NO treatment at all because I did not want to deal with a new doctor and all the "funny" looks we get when we try to explain our pain, I finally found Dr. Gatell in February. I had not worked in 6 years and was spending 4-5 days in the bed. I wrote an email explaining my situation and he got me in right away, the next day!!

In the office, he spent over an hour listening to me and telling me to relax over and over, that he would not judge and he would make sure my pain was controlled. I was all wound up, speaking quickly and laughing nervously like I do when I'm very nervous. He eventually settled me down and got the whole long history out of me, got my records from previous doctors and prescribed the meds that have drastically improved my quality of life. He is "quirky" as some have said but NEVER have I felt like the small piece of dirt that other doctors have treated me as. Anyway, what physician/specialist have you seen that didn't, in some way, act quirky?

As for Maggie, his assistant, she has NEVER written my scripts. Each visit I am required to complete a questionnaire about my pain levels, pain frequency and effect of meds. The new board-certified pain physician (the Indian doctor referred to in previous posts) is reviewing the records, making the decisions and handling RXs. Maggie simply hands them to you at the front desk and collects your payment. Nothing about this is illegal or corrupt in any way.

If not for these people taking care of me I would not able to be out job-hunting, shopping and doing those things that I missed for years while I laid around in major pain. I cannot be critical of Dr. Gatell or the way his practice is run right now. I think he's doing all he can to make sure the patients are taken care of while he works through his own personal problems. No other doctor I've ever seen would take time to get someone in to handle their patients for any extended period of time. They would simply drop you, take care of themselves and start over again later- So kudos to him for making sure we can be treated while he works through whatever....HIS business and I really don't care what it is!!!

This post is not directed to anyone in particular. I know nothing about this doctor, so I am just speaking generaly. Most of us know how hard it is to find a doctor that will fully treat pain. Many doctors either under prescribe or don't prescribe narcotics at all. This is blamed on all kinds of reasons; fear of the DEA, fear of lawsuites, mountains of paperwork and so on. Whatever the motivation, the fact that finding a doctor to prescribe narcotics is difficult, to say the least,is obvious to those of us in chronic pain. Whenever a doctor is found that will prescribe, there always seem to be a list of problems that develope. The doctor has disciplinay problems. The doctor has many complaints. The doctor's motivation is called into question. I'm not sure why this is, but I have a theory. Either the doctor was in some kind of trouble; financialy, ethically or legally and has been "forced" into prescribing narcotics. Most of us know of doctors that have followed this pattern (one has even decided to change their sex and advertise like Toys-R-Us :)). These are the ones that make the news and end up in jail. The other kind of doctor seems to be actually compationate and treats pain dispite the threat of prosecution and persecution. They go out of their way to follow ever rule, keep proper documentaion and stay active in the care of their patients. Many of these doctors still find themselves in trouble. Why? I believe it is because when it becomes known that these doctors prescribe narcotics, not only do people in chronic pain seek them out, those that abuse drugs do as well. This leads to trouble for the doctor no matter what they do. They are either duped by these drug seeking scumbags and end up in trouble when someone ODs or is caught selling their drugs or they identify the druggies and cut them off. The druggy then becomes angry that they can't "score" off this doctor and start trouble by complaining to anybody who will listen about how unethical this doctor is. It really seems like a no win situation for doctors that care. Patients need to help those doctors that help them by defending their reputation and by being responsible with the medication that many need to live.

Very wise post tjt, I agree, and honestly I think his motivations lie with the latter point. I think any of his problems are personal in nature and not related to his practice. But I would say his few legal or board issues lie in the fact that he was duped by druggies or dealers. I think since then he has reformed his practice, so I would say stay away unless you have a legit medical issue! He prob does not just write scripts.

tjt - yes, you've said it quite concisely and accurately (IMHO).

Bird - yes, during the NROP days, people took advantage of the ease and cheap (compared to the present), but it was still a "gray area" then. Probably rationalizing, but since there was not a specific law against it, people utilized those services.

That has changed. Now there is a specific law stating the requirements. No gray area. It is not a matter of hypocrisy but a matter of the facts. It sucks. Yes, I agree.

When someone (like myself) states it is illegal, it is because it is. Without a F2F. I am never being judgmental - au contraire (I've got no place to be that way, lol), but just trying to be helpful. I have done enough blatantly illegal things in my life, that I would never judge someone else. The nightmare teenager of the century, lol.

I truly hope we all can obtain the care we deserve. I have had a poster criticize me because I get pain meds from my doc. Yes, I do, but I must walk a fine line. I don't ask for dose increases (even tho it's been over 5 years), always go the accepted amount of days, etc.

I never want to come off as judgmental. I don't believe in that. Noone has the right to judge another. If you are "perfect", OK, but that ain't ever going to be true.

Group hug, Rain

Well if you accepted 12 scripts I would think that's the type of people you like,yeah? Furthermore,you came in here accusing this doctor and his staff of unethical behavior,you wnet so far as to delve into his private life and even accused him of receiving a DUI,without any proof besides your word. Where's Dr. Gatell's side of the story? From what you've posted I'm inclined to believe Maggie.
Man,not only do these doctors have to deal with the DEA,but disgruntled patients who smear their names all over internet websites. I can fully understand why he retired. Keep up the good work,Samples. Too bad there's not a website for doctors to post threads about staying away from you

There is a person in the thread on a doctor that is facing some legal troubles who seems like the one here. All was fine and dandy when they were obtaining their prescriptions but along the way the patient felt wronged and turned up in the anonymous form of the Internet tough guy/trouble shooter of justice and posted a ton of negative information.

It's too bad that people don't just move on from their negative experience and use the information to better educate themsleves in future dealings.

To those who are interested I went in to Dr Gatell's office this week for my appointment. He is still not in the practice but there is talk he may return. I personally hope he does despite all the negatives on the board, he did care and I know you can talk to his patients and they all love him and will tell you their own story of the difference he has made in their pain management. Ditto for me.

Anyway, the current substitute is keeping people on the same regimens that Dr. G had them on. For me, this is way more than anyone else would ever give me and I am really grateful to not have to live in pain. If anyone is interested, PM me.

And I stand by my statement that Maggie is a trooper. She is keeping this practice open by bringing in interim doctors to help the patients until something permanent is established. She cares as well because I can tell you she is jumping thru hoops to keep us (the patients) from having to go into withdrawal, and from having to suffer with pain.

Seems like the long term plan is to bring in another Pain Management Physician that currently has a small practice to operate a satellite facility here. Maggie will be able to keep the practice open with these two doctors and I think Dr. Gatell will return at some point. If not, seems like the new arrangement will work out good for all involved.

I did not get "ripped off" and at no point felt like I was in an unethical or dangerous situation. I think the only ones mad are the addicts who got kicked out for not following the Rules. We don't want them in there anyway. I am standing up for Dr. Gatell, for Maggie and for the practice. They have courage and are helping people. How many people have the likes of "Samples" helped with their ridiculous rants. If you have any more questions, PM me as I don't think we should be smearing this practice all over the board. They are there to help those who need help and you will get much more value than any of the F2F services being advertised in this area. Cost is more reasonable too!

birdtruck

Bird, I am glad your experience was a positive one. I hope it continues to be.

I think others have reservations about this doc. Maybe a little research? I, personally, have no idea. But it bothers me a little that he has resorted to hypnosis. That doesn't mean anything in and of itself, but I wonder.

As to Maggie - none of know her and it is better to keep our judgments to ourselves. They are "under the gun" so to speak. Must comply with the law in addition to treating patients.

May you get the treatment you surely deserve. Must go, don't feel well.

Rain.

If the end result one is seeking is a pain free life, then hypnosis (assuming that it works) is very good, but it has been my experience that real pain is real pain. L4 and L5 trouble, tooth (temporary as it may be) or amputation must be dealt with in an effective manner.
I have heard withdrawal from sub is easier than others, but have never experienced it. Methadone, however, is a real [censored], that lasts a real long time.

It is always sad to me when a doc that is understanding goes down due to political or societal pressure. Socrates prescribed opium and cannabis for migraines, and it seems that he may have been onto something.
As far as NSAID treatment for headaches, I use Naprox as a preventative measure every morning. When that does not work, I try to use a 15 mg oxycodone medication. There also is a oxy-ibu med that would be really useful for migraines.

Hi Gang,
I am very impressed with both the positive and negative things you had to say about me.
I hope that God will allow me to return back to work someday soon. But, I just want t5o all let you know that I love you all very much with all my heart.
I tried to be courageous for you all and tried to help you with your severe chronic pain when the others doctors did not care, or were too afraid to stick their license out there for you.
There is a fine line with treating chronic pain and watching out for for the drug abusers and drug diverters.
But, over the last year I have had the opportunity to learn a lot more in helping myself be a better pain doctor and now an addictionologist expert once I get my medical license back - God willing!
As for Maggie, she has been my Angel, like my mother was for me - with caring of my patients and unconditional love the best that she could.
I promise you that helping to return patients back to life again with adequate pain control is so hard to do. But, it is do-able with good caring medical staff.
I promise you, that if and when I have a second chance to help you again, I will be the best pain doctor that there could possibly be. I am studying the works of Dr. Lynn Webster very carefully to bring you the best possible care, even if you have both chronic pain and addiction.
You all desrve to have a wonderful life again and not have to suffere from unbearable pain ever again.
I also will like to begin writing about how to treat chronic pain and addiction once I get back to work as a pain speciailist-addictionologist one day soon like Dr. Webster and the works of Dr. Charles L. Whitfield.
Sincerely Yours,
John A. Gatell, MD
AKA G-Doc

Dr. Gatell,

Thanks so much for responding to our thread. I am very sorry to hear about your license, but hope you are able to recover it soon. We need more doctors that are compassionate and knowledgeable. We need more people like you who are able to put themselves into the shoes of real CP sufferers and take a stand against the injustice that is done every day. I suspect it must be hard to do a job that pain specialists do. With the rampant abuse of drugs, sifting through the masses and being able to find the real patients who have been neglected is most certainly a tough job. But what is even more tough, is taking these patients and actually relieving their pain knowing that might put your livelihood on the line! Bravo sir and I wish you well.

I think we are all curious though, what the current status of your practice is, and what the fate of your current patients will be? And please keep us updated from time to time on your progress or any tips and help you can provide. This forum could use a good pain doctor to comment and provide support, even if you want to do it under an anonymous name.

Painstaking

Dr. G -

I am so glad you appear to be in good spirits and planning to return if able. You can read from my previous posts that I have always been on your side and believe in you, your motives, your achievements and ability.
And Maggie is held in as high a regard as you are in my book.
Will the practice be able to remain open in your extended absence? What do you think. Those of us that have been helped by you are eternally grateful and I hope I can continue to receive care in your absence.
If there is anything we can do to help you in regards to letters, petitions, or whatever may help, I for one am willing and I'm sure many more are as well. All you have to do is ask and let us know what we can do. Please respond and we are there for you. PM if needed.

birdtruck

[quote=GDoc]
I tried to be courageous for you all and tried to help you with your severe chronic pain when the others doctors did not care, or were too afraid to stick their license out there for you.
There is a fine line with treating chronic pain and watching out for for the drug abusers and drug diverters.
But, over the last year I have had the opportunity to learn a lot more in helping myself be a better pain doctor and now an addictionologist expert once I get my medical license back - God willing![quote]

Would you mind sharing the circumstamces involved with the loss of your medical license?
And what will be required of you in order to get it back?
Thank you

I cannot stress enough how important it is at the initial screening level to determine the 1) identification of the patient and 2) their need for pain medication or anxiety medication. Either that, or the doctor has to deny the patient, and this gives the patient the opportunity to be vindictive because they know the info about the doctor. It is a really tough line to walk. Perhaps nurses or medical assistants could get the records together or the records could be sent to the doctor for screening as to who he/she wants to see. I know that the actual appointment is important as well, and I am going to go out on a limb and say that people should visit the doctor MORE than once a year if they want to protect the relationship. Finally, the number of patients being written scripts is always a red flag for the DEA or state boards. Doctors usually know when this limit is reached. OCS' should not book a lot of patients with one doctor and he or she should certainly not be writing a lot of scripts--especially for the SAME medication or schedule II. It would not hurt if the doctors were willing to get a copy of some PDMP records and yes, run the patient through it to see if their name is in it. Patients should be prepared for a call to their primary if things don't look right.

Patients: Know that your RX WILL BE available to your state PDMP in most instances. There are only a few states that have
none.

I have been lucky enough to start representing a few docs on a proactive basis while they determine if they want to do pain management. The big question is "What am I getting into?" The big fear is that they will be sent patients with records that are insufficient and that they will get the anger, not the OCS when they deny the RX. Dr. Gatell sounds like he got caught in someone's anger. Maybe the person who complained had a history of doing this with other OCS. Too bad there is not a system for dealing with the former OCS. I know some places do that, which is good.

Of course, we rarely know the whole story. The best situation is to be proactive and dot your I's and cross your T's. Go a step beyond complying with the RHA. Order blood tests for liver damage, other drugs, or just a regular screening panel because you want to show that you have a relationship with the patient. If the patient doesn't have insurance, or says they can't afford it, there are programs in virtually every state. If they can afford an RX, they can afford a blood test. If it is NEEDED, it should be done.

I am writing this as a result of conversations recently with doctors and others. If you don't agree with it, please comment as to why. If you have other suggestions or experiences that can add to this, and perhaps shed light on the good doctor and how others can avoid his path, I would like to hear it.

No it is sad bc Dr Gatell has had his pain mngmt practice open there for upwards of 10 years. There has never been a problem that the board would be inclined to suspend his license on. But along come a few rotten eggs and they get by somewhow. Mix that with the current pain pill climate, it makes a recipe for disaster. This was a very sad situation and I can only hope that the state and federal government combine forces along with the boards and actually give a set of guidelines for a physician practicing pain management and what that entails. Entitled "How not to have us yank your license". That way, the doctors can try their best to both treat CP patients and also be able to just continue to work without threat of action or intimidation. Sad Sad Sad.

What I don't understand is why the LE expects doctors to double as policemen. They should be free to practice, to help their patients, if an addict or someone with unlawfull intentions manages to weazel his way in because he has the proper documentation, that is not the Doctors fault, and he should not be expected to detect them all. They are frauds and criminals that are pros at passing themselves off as legitimate pain paitients. Let LE go after the criminal not the Doctor. That is simply my opinion. And I think that is what happened to Dr. Gatel. I don't know him, I've read alot about him and his practice, and I almost drove from New Orleans to see him back around 2002 but circumstances prevented me from doing that. Everyone have a great holiday season. Thank you all for being here! One more thing. Why waste the billions of $ we spend locking up people who do become addicted or dependent on pain killers, I say, why not take a portion of that money to provide treatment. They can be treated for both their addiction and CP ailment. In this civilized world I think even the person who suffers from addiction due to long term chronic pain deserves to be treated for his pain and his addiction, and there are pain specialist who specialize in addictionology also, but even they are harassed by the DEA. What a shame. Lets lock up the gang members and traffickers, the violent criminals that plague our society, and use the money we waste on locking up innocent nonviolet people who happen to have a drug dependency. If every drug available were decriminalized at the least, the addiction level would stay about the same as it is now. That was proven with prohibition during the 1920's. The crime rate dropped damatically after they repealed prohibition. They outlawed alcohol, and violent crime went totally out of control. They repealed it and broke the back of organized crime, they,"the criminal gangs" had to rely on other rackets such as gambling, prostitution, loan sharking, etc... There will always be criminals. But we can lower the ranks of our inmates by 2/3,s and use that money to treat and monitor our inocent people with addiction problems who are not violent criminals, monitor them closely, and possibly make a big dent in the national budget crises at the same time. I'm sorry if I am off topic or whatever. Maybe I should have posted this under politics or something. But Doctor Gatels problem was tragic and unecessary, and I do think this posts does belong in this thread because of its relationship to the good doctors tragic situation. I am sorry to write so much but I think it needs to be said, and I think that everyone with these same sentiments should gather together and make themselves heard. The present day implimentation of the governments so called war on drugs is a travisty to all of our society. It effects us all. It is rediculous to spend the amount of $ we spend to lock up inocent people and turn them into criminals for the sole reason that they have to become hard in order to just survive their sentence, for some simple mistake, that was caused by a drug dependency problem that was developed solely because of an intractable pain problem. I think that it is society, and our elected officials that have a lesson to learn from this. Dr. Gatel wasn't doing anything wrong to lose his licence and most of his livelyhood. To the admin. I'll say again I'm sorry if I am out of line with this post, I hope you will let me know if I am. I am very knew to posting, although I have been a member on and off since the beggining of this site almost. Again I hope that everyone here has the best holiday season ever if that is possible!

Base on the cases I have seen it is one of a couple of things:

1) fake meds from a real OCS that has own pharmacy (really isnt an issue now that you know who is gone

2) WAY more likely: the doctor has too many pain patients and set off red flags or:

a. doc always writes same script for same drug, even same quantity (really bad idea to do, they should vary the quantity--too bad if patients don't like getting 5 more or less. Better than getting busted for doing nothing wrong

b. NEVER write Sch II

c. have a normal office visit. Spend a sufficient amount of time. Take copious notes. take patients picture if necessary. Ask for ID. In one case, the DEA is disputing that there ever WAS a doctor visit with patient. The patient purchased something at docs office (OTC) and had receipt. Now, patient takes pic of outside bldg and gets gas and stuff near docs office. How sad to be made that paranoid!

d. DOCS-always live up to your promise. Ticked off patients are the worst to deal with. They are the number one source of complaints. When I mean promise, I mean if a person has refills and pharmacy goes belly up, help them to best of your ability, not be black mailed.

I agree the DEA has put this burden on docs, but also has on consumers. How about telling someone that their first mistake was seeing a doctor whow was fully licensed in four states and had no discipline record?

There comes a time when docs will need to find out why this is being done.

I would bet ya it is because a certain doc is writing too many scripts. In most recent case, pharmacy couldn;t keep up with his orders and he had two websites of his own and walk in. Who knows how many DEA undercover walked in there for his OV. He may have gotten sloppy.

Anyway......I would be interested in finding out about Dr. G and why he was busted. Someone has to know.It is good to know what the DEA thinks is wrong--too bad they dont come out and tell you.


Anyway......

My doc told me once that early refills is also a flag for the DEA. I wanted to ask her how she knew that and what else were flags but I didn't.

She also does not seem to want to script me anything besides 5/500s. At one time, when I was in much more pain that usual and asked for something stronger, she asked if I had tried taking 2.

I am ok w/her and what she scripts as it works for me, just thought I'd add what she had told me, to this thread.

meonlytis--good points! I wonder if we can get a list together from all here. maybe the dea can do outreach and do a q&a on the boards. ha ha....that would be interesting

Gdoc:
Welcome to our site, thank you for posting and best wishes...

If you plan to continue posting, and we hope you do, please contact us to verify you are who you say you are.

Thanks

I know my pain clinic doc was taken to court and beat it and they won't mess with him now again (well as long as he stays on the up and up) he required a state criminal back ground check ( for drug convictions or violent crimes only ), a contract for using the same pharmacy-not diverting-etc the usual, ID of course, drug screens and random counts. I think any doc that does that should be o.k. You could go to him without any extensive previous records. I know at the time i didn't even have a xray to my credit, just alot of pain.

Best of Luck Dr. G sounds like you helped alot of people.

Well, looks like Dr. Gatell is done, at least in Georgia, and I'm back to a life of pain with no doctor to treat me. It took me 20 years to find Dr G and now I'm going to be back to 3-5 days a week in bed with pain, unable to work and live a normal life.

While I was in Dr. G's office yesterday for my appt the DEA came in with a warrant. They interviewed us (the patients) and we, of course, tried to stand up for Dr G. They then let us go so I don't know what happened to Maggie or anyone else, only that it can't be good. However, I have no problem defending everything Dr G has done for me because I was productive again and living well for the first time in years.

I am so disgusted with this mess. I am back to square one. I don't know if any doctor in Georgia will treat me to the extent that I can live normally and I'm so scared of what will happen to me that right now that it's all I can think about. I missed work today, of course, and probably will lose many more days of my life. I was so happy to be back on track and really living that this is going to kill me. This last year and a half since I've been treated appropriately has been awesome. I've actually become active and "human" again. I don't know where to go for help or if there is even anywhere I can go because who knows how I will get copies of my records!?!

Everyone please keep Dr G in their thoughts and prayers. As I said previously, I feel like he saved my life and now it's just over with no hope of getting help. If anyone knows of a good doc in Georgia, preferably near Atlanta, I'd love to know about it because I'm stuck with no treatment and severe pain, as we all suffer. email luckyleo86@yahoo.com