this article explains a lot. It's truly a police-state when the gov't tells doctors how to be doctors.

In the UK, Dr's answer to the British Medical Association (BMA). There are also a specialised branch of police who's job is to simply check pharmicsts prescribing records every month, week and spot checks, and all they're really doing is checking his stocks against Rx's.
It is the pharmacists job to inform on Dr's who appear to be over-prescribing, the BMA then look into the Dr's pratice and patient prescribing. If the Dr is treating addicts, has a high percentage of pain sufferer's, then he is simply left alone, or given help. If he has become an unwitting supplier of black market meds he is warned, given adequate time to put his house in order, or if he wishes he can have drug agency help him in his surgery. No one who has became an addict will be left out in the cold,they will get help.
If a person recieving opiates dies, an autopsy and tribunal is carried out. If it appears the patient took his whole script in one go, or took other drugs, alcohol, benzo's unbeknown to the Dr, the dr is exonarated. The patient never followed the Dr's order's. If Dr constantly misreads patients mental state ie;suicidal depression, he may lose his right to prescribe schII meds. If he is continually negligant, he lose's his right to pratice.
Medicine and prescribing pratices are laid down by Doctors, pharmacists, ex-doctors. Doctors who do not follow the laid down pratices or are under suspicion are judged by their peers. Not the police. There have been cases of dr's who became heroin addicts, abused their position, forging scripts, only to be found out by the pharmacists. This becomes a police matter(forgery) and the dr banned for life from praticing and put in rehab.

No armed police in surgies

The BMA has always been a regulatory body existing to protect doctors and patient rights. Earlier in the twentieth centurary the American political system tried to impose its might upon the british pharmacopia with a world wide ban on Heroin. The BMA fought tooth and nail to stop this from happening in Britain, which they achieved. Their main reason, heroin is far more soluble as well as far stronger. Emaciated cancer patients couldnt tolerate high enough dose of morphine injections because of the excess in liquid. With Heroin(the strongest narcotic of the time), being far more soluble, a far higher and stronger dose could be dissolved in a minute amount of water, giving the victim relief. Thankfully there are far stronger analgesics now, as well as patches.

Medicine is not the realm of police.

I'm ready to start making some noise...

After 5 years of taking NSAIDS, (my doc even preferrs to prescribe PREDNISONE over vicodin) I started bleeding out my @ss. Now I've got nothing left but opioids and lidocaine patches. I have tendonitis in both arms, carpal tunnel in my right wrist, osteoarthritis, bursitis, and it turns out I have a seriously torn shoulder that is going to require surgery.

I'm not even 30 yet.

My doc gave me 60 5/325s. The MOST I have ever got and she wants me on *LESS* next month...that's why I'm here. I don't know what else to do.

i guess i see things a little different than most.adults are aware of the dangers if any of narcotic drugs.if i want to smoke or drink i can go to the store and buy all i want.ill argue with anyone that either is way more unhealthy than pain killers so why all the "drama" over pain pills? to me its simple,money! what else can it be if you really stop and think.the government claims its concerned about your health but we can use all the tobacco and alcohol we choose to.i mean lets be for real! if the medication helps live a better and happier life then why keep that from people?!?

They are trying to figure out how to get the most money out of us without looking like D dealers(government ) and government officials that own pharmacy stocks with would be most of them --lol

Actually, you'd be surprised how many "kids" are sneaking prescription drugs from their parents' medicine cabinets.

I live in a town with a population of about 40,000. A couple years ago, at age 30-something, I became addicted to hydrocodone, not for the pain-killing effect but for the side effect that is usually the "buzz" or "high" that people refer to...a cloud of ambivalence that fuzzes up your brain and relieves stress, making life in general easier to tolerate. (Also, hydrocodone is an excellent appetite suppressant, but I already weighed 130 pounds at the time, so that wasn't my desired effect from the drug.)

Given the fact that I was an "addict" with no legitimate medical need and was not able to obtain hydrocodone by going to see a doctor, I paid street prices ($6.00 to $8.00 per pill for any of the "tens" - yellow, blue, green, pink, dark blue, generic white). Almost ALL the "drug dealers" were teenagers who obtained the medications by stealing from their parents. A couple sources were young adults who were receiving up to 15 prescriptions per month in various names and selling them to people like me.

A typical phone call to any of the sources would generally consist of "Hey, have you seen Lori lately?" (Asking if the person has or knows where to get lortabs.) You would then find out which variety (color & hydro/APAP mix) and the per pill price when you were told what she was wearing..."Yeah, she's here, and she's got a pretty green dress on today. She only paid $7.00 for it." The next line in the script would be how many pills you wanted..."Well, tell her to stay there, I'll be right over, I owe her $21.00." (Meaning you wanted to purchase three pills at $7.00 each.)

At any local high school here, you can mention "lori" and kids will start salivating. They not only know what you are talking about, they are users. A casual "back aching stretch" and sotto voce deliverance of a sentence, "Geez, I'd love a 'tab right about now," would let you know at your place of employment if anyone in earshot was a user or seller.

FedEx has become the DEA's watchdog...turning in the names and addresses of people who are receiving packages that either contain pill bottles or are sent from known pharmacies. (This I know personally because the DEA knocked on my front door in a FedEx costume to deliver a 'script, and they brought along the county narcotics division to join the party.)

It is hard to obtain some prescription medications because the existence of abuse is prevalent and rampant. It won't go away, so the noose gets tighter and tighter. People can be found anywhere (especially on internet message boards) swearing on a stack of Bibles that they have an honest-to-God legitimate medical NEED for something when all their "need" consists of is the same need a junkie has for a needle. A fix. A high. A buzz. You'll get the same song and dance you can find a million other places...high school football injury, tragic bicycle accident as a teen, motorcycle wreck, degenerative spinal problem, and so on...the list is endless, but in all likelihood, very few of these people ACTUALLY "need" what they are seeking.

Yes, SOME are legit. But MOST are not. It really doesn't take much effort to weed out the users from the abusers.

(I'm not attempting to hold a precarious perch atop a soapbox with this post...I still occasionally ferret out a "source" for a pill or two, but it's a far cry from the $1,500.00 a month habit I once had.)

• Quote:
  FedEx has become the DEA's watchdog...turning in the names and addresses of people who are receiving packages that either contain pill bottles or are sent from known pharmacies.

Isn't it legal to order from an online pharmacy? Like if you see a doctor then fax the script to the pharmacy for fill and delivery?

Couldn't resist throwing in my two cents. I was insulted FOR YOU, by that post, who does need these medications. I, too, am a recovering addict from painkillers and other things. And it does make it harder for legitimate people to get meds. Very hard. The majority of people I met in my lifetime who took meds for pain were actually in pain and not drugseeking a "buzz". And I used drugs for over 25 years. What a lot of addicts won't admit and aren't aware of is that you don't get that level of "euphoric buzz" when you are in legitimate pain. You get relief, somewhat, and maybe a little drowsy. That's it. I know because of all the surgeries I've had, some to get pills and some for legitimate medical reasons. Like the thoracic sympathectomies, x3, I had many years ago. Dilaudid was prescribed after the doctor nicked an artery on the second surgery and I was bleeding internally and needed a third operation to save my life. Also had to take Demerol and Vistaril mixed just to roll over in the morning because I would stiffen up during the night, if I slept at all. Recovery took almost a year total. No buzz. I just was paralyzed for about two weeks in one arm and shoulder and then, it came back to life in a real painful way. Dilaudid barely helped, but no buzz. In fact, what was left over, I threw away.

I had wisdom teeth removed once and the dentist didn't give me the prescripton before I left the office for my pain meds to take home, so when I called the following morning, since they were closed when I reached home, he accused me of lying! At that time, I wasn't an addict. Just naive. And yes, there are plenty of bad apples that have ruined it for legitimate patients who need help to get through the day. My husband, a carpet installer, with three crushed discs, in addition, also fell from a 15 foot staircase, needed meds, and I saw very few doctors that were willing to not under-prescribe for this person who STILL went to work everyday to support us with these injuries, hauling carpet on his back! Only after they saw the MRI's, did they start to understand his pain and prescribe whatever he needed until we had insurance to get an operation. And he will always need some type of pain medication just to survive, because HE STILL HAD TO GO TO WORK. He was given oxycontin, which of course I stole at that time. I'm no longer using pain meds, I do take a valium or xanax from time to time, from my Doctor, because I'm bipolar (isn't everyone! LOL), but I regret making life harder for chronically ill people.


I work in a company where heavy lifting and moving is normal and many, many of my coworkers have back injuries, and I gotta say, I thank God I never injured my back. They are miserable almost every time they have to lift freight or move heavy items, or just out of the blue one day when it flares up. And they will never be without some pain. It's awful. Just because that person was a drugseeker, he can't fathom that everyone isn't using them for thrills. And most people are not. I know this and so does he. Don't you give up looking for a understanding doc. I found that my husband was best treated by female doc's. They just seem to understand better. May God bless you and good luck to you. Take care of yourself.
ragamuffin.

Again, just have to stick my nose in the subject, because I'm a recovering addict-painkillers mostly. It isn't the patients abusing the meds, it's the doc's underprescribing because they sometimes have no choice, that force patients to seek drugs elsewhere, or even smoke and drink to excess just to survive. I know this for fact. My husband was seriously injured and soon became an alcoholic. I had legit medical reasons sometimes and some, I didn't. Very few doc's would even take the time to order tests to see if I was telling the truth. I also injured my wrist once, and for over a year it was unbearably painful. I listened to soooo many docs tell me I didn't need Vicodin because only "cancer" patients needed that. WEll I finally found an orthopaedic surgeon, who happened to be the doc/surgeon for some NFL, MLB, and NHA teams, won't say which, who believed me, and finally opened me up for surgery and couldn't believe how bad it really was. The bones had no cartilidge left surrounding them and were turning to "mush" to quote him, from rubbing together so long. He said it's no wonder you've been in so much pain for so long. He's the best doc I ever had. Fixed me up, took out some bones in my wrist, with a hammer and a chisel, good as new. And he never underprescribed for me. When it was time to cut me off, he tapered me off them slowly. I regret the years I spent using, and making it harder for patients who needed meds, even affected my own treatments. That's my fault. Not good docs. And the DEA too. They all want to be heroes. Let's start with shutting down the methadone clinics I went to for a high for so long. They are legalized drug abuse, often funded by the government!!!! And I never once used Heroin. Just pain meds and cocaine. How's that for our system. How about tougher drug laws for street drugs, dealers, and people like me who forged prescriptons, altered them, or stole them. HMMMMM.. ragamuffin

I think it's great you were honest. I personally don't think you should feel bad, you were honest in saying you liked to take them, which, yes it does make it harder to get for people who need them but at the same time, honesty I find is very important.

I personally would be lying if I said there have been a few times where I didn't enjoy it. I mean when you've been hurting and sore all day some guys come home, and have beer. No problem with that but I don't drink much when at all, and when I was working alone in a cell phone shop all day, my back and legs would be killing me when I got home, I didn't want Beer, I'd graba Vicodin ES or 3 and try to relax because the throbbing would finally stop.

Some days 2 was good enough so I could get up to actually have dinner, but there were a few days where I would come home like OK this hurts bad, and I'd grab 3 tablets befor eI could get back out of my chair.

I'm not a druggie who's all about being stoned, I'm a computer geek with decent talent and skill who has back problems, shoulder problems, and a very bad knee and ankle that flair up when they decide it's time too.

Anyway jhust wanted to chime in and say that my post wasn't directed at you, as you seem to have already seen what these laws and under perscribing can do.

I know it might be hard for some people who don't take pain pills to understand that 3 Vicodin ES didn't even make me stoned in the slightest but they don't.

I've driven on OxyContin, Demerol, Dilauded, and Vicodin ES without a problem, they just don't give me a huge stoned feeling.

Thanks for being Honest and Thanks for the Blessings

Heard lots of different stories about onlinesolution 4 U, are they dependable??

I will tell you all the LE in this country (USA) has the technology and has to spend the money so they can get the same or more next year that they will ruin your life in order to look like the hero. I belong to the second largest outlaw motorcycle clubs in the world. just under three years ago 15 or so members were arrested including the presedent of the club. Without getting into details we will focus just on the club pres. the Gov. spent $23,000,000 in servalence just to arrest him for nuthin and he was out in 2 years. He did nothing wrong just was in control of something the goverment did not control. If the GOV. in this county did not want the pills we buy in here they would never get through the system. but if you dont get busted driving on them then they make less money. I got a DUI 9 years ago and it cost me at least $10,000. remember its all about the money nothing else.

That may be partially true, but there is a lot of interests involved behind prescription drugs. I seriously doubt the DEA keeps a file on every Tom, Dick and Harry that orders a script online -- it isn't worth their time. If someone is double and triple dipping, it will probably raise some red flags for the intent to distribute, though.

Pharmaceutical companies put A LOT of money behind their products. Patents only last so long, so they have to reinvent a new pain pill or benzo every now and then to milk the system. They have lobbyists in congress making sure that their products get prescribed, along with giving kickbacks to doctors for prescribing whatever their pill of the month may be.

As far as the whole "buzz" factor, who really cares? There are a lot of people who self-medicate due to the convoluted U.S. health system. The price of insurance is skyrocketing, doctors are getting forced out of business due to overwhelming personal liability premiums and meanwhile there are people with legitimate needs that simply can't afford the outrageous cost of health care.

The old adage is to follow the money trail but that is extremely difficult since, when it comes to prescription drugs, there are so many money trails.

From the original article by admin - (I don't know how to quote yet!!)

"In another case of DEA strong-arm tactics, more than 20 agents burst into a Dallas pain clinic in June. The agents kicked down doors, ransacked the office of Dr. Daniel Maynard, and handcuffed patients, including an elderly woman with a stroller and an oxygen tank."

I grew up knowing Dr. Maynard as friend, not doctor. My mom and dad own a Home Health Equipment Company and Maynard owned the building in Dallas they rented, and sent them many referrals, so I bet that walker and oxygen tank came from my mom's office!!!!
The whole story shocked us as a family, because if you knew Maynard, you would know that he was not in any way out for a quick buck, but had a THRIVING practice, trouble was the part of town it was in....There were crack dealers on every corner and many of their elderly family members had scripts from Maynard that were stolen from grandma to turn a buck on the street. What a shame. He was there in a neighborhood no other doctor would dare set up shop in (same reason my mom and dad went there - for legitimate need and they only dealt hospital beds and wheelchairs, etc...no drugs or needles!), because he cared and knew these people needed QUALITY care. ABSOLUTELY SICKENING!!!!!!!!!!

No wonder nobody wants to help the poorer communities of our nation. They get bit in the a$$ for it.

Just a follow up to my last post. I asked around about whatever happened to Maynard and turns out their were no convictions, and as a result the Dallas Police Dept is being investigated for planting evidence in a number of related cases in conjunction with higher up LE.
A great man loses his license, and all for show.
Thinkin' 'boot moving to Canada.
Cheers,Laroo

I am with you on that!!! Thinkin bout movin elsewhere myself!

Back when I was 11 and my sister 9, we were both molested by our father. That was 32 years ago. I was being prepared to testify on the stand as I was the only 1 of 5 that was able to do it at that time. The other three were 12, 13, 15. I was scared to death of my dad and hated him. Somewhere inside I knew that if I did not do it, he would get managing conservatorship of one and visitation rights with the other -- in other words, we'd be subjected to him until we were adults. I set aside my subjective feelings and went for the objective. When my dad saw me walking down the courtroom hall, he knew he had better back down. So he gave up all visitation rights and agreed to paid child support. Thank God it didn't happen as I'd have been the poster girl because back then even though it went on you never heard about it. For years I had night terrors. The only thing the doctor would recommend was some OTC antihisamine commonly used for sleep. I did that for almost 20 years. Finally, when I was diagnosed with hypothroidism and my doctor asked me how I felt. I told him I felt fine. The blood work came back and he said, "There's no way you could be feeling fine." So when I told him the weird hours I worked, my childhood and the way my husband is, he told me, "It's amazing you are doing as well as you are. Most people come in here with anything resembling your story can't make decisions." He asked me how much sleep I was geting. I told him 3, which is awful for someone who is diabetic (not overweight diabetic, overtired diabetic). And thus my introduction to Ambien. And it was while I was on Ambien I remembered that these night terrors were in fact reality. People have a tendency to think that young people don't need them, except obvious illnesses like cancer or heart disease. The situation with my dad - the only person who truly spoke to me in a heart-to-heart conversation, caring and open was my poor deceased grandmother. I miss her something terrible.

ahh....interesting

These folks had terrific lawyers...that is why they got off w/just rehab. And, by the way, if I am not mistaken, Jeb's daughter actually did do some sort of time...not sure what kind of facility, but she kept screwing up. Alot of times, the court system has to catch up with the accused lawbreaker, with motions (as they say in the legal profession.."Blanketing them with paper"), and this would cause things to move very slowly. That may be the case with Rush, and if so, he (Rush) and his lawyers, family etc, may have decided to go ahead and enter rehab, since he probably figured it would be coming eventually, and that the court may look more favorably on his case if had been clean and sober for some time once it went to trial. I do know that Rush's legal team has been trying to block the overly zealous State's Attny from accessing his private medical records, which all of us should be supporting. I don't care who you are, or what you may suffer from, but there should very strict controls on who may access your medical records...period, end of story.

By the way, I don't think that this is another case of the vast right wing conspiracy getting off scot free...alot of times it is up to the discretion of the judge, and that certainly varies a great deal from individual to individual.

Just some thoughts...

Peace,
Katy

Have been having trouble too.

G

I'm also having problems using promo codes.

I have dealt with this issue since my pain started, which funny enough, was about 5 years ago. Looks like around the time prescribing opoids became an issue...or a bigger issue maybe I should say.

I really wish there was something we could all do together to make someone understand how it feels to deal with pain on a daily basis and how if we didn't have this pain we wouldn't need to take a freakin' pill! Do they actually think we like to take medication every day knowing it will not remove the pain but just dull it enough for us to function?

If I had one wish it would be for these DEA people to be in our shoes for just 1 day! Just 1 and see what it feels like and what we go through. Of course that wouldn't make them understand the long term effects of being in pain every day or the other medical problems being in pain causes but at least they would see IT IS REAL, IT HURTS AND IT'S VERY FRUSTRATING!!!!

I could go on and on about this topic but I won't. Reading and hearing all of this really fires me up though! If they didn't make it so hard to get the medication from our doctors we physically see we woudn't need to turn to the internet. Thank God the people are running these business trying to help us out!

Great article and advise

It really amazes me when I read articles that tell health care providers how to detect "drug seeking" behaviors.

The ones that I find especially objectionable are:

The patient uses words like "suffering"

The patient exhibits a lot of knowledge of medication and/or symptoms. Uses medical terminology.

What is one supposed to say? "Oh, I'm hurtin real bad, doc". I think it's 'cause I got some problem down in my tailbone..." or "I got a busted back bone awhile back and it really smarts"...

I even read somewhere that is a patient acts like they can't pronounce the name of the med (uh, it's hydro-something or other) that is another sign.

So, you're damned if you do or damned if you don't

Give me a break. With the internet, people are educating themselves about options for their health care. Is there some law that says a layperson can't use terms like Degenerative Disk Disease or trochanteric bursitis (these came to mind as I have both of these conditions)?

Australia sounds bloody fair dinkum, eh mate?

My PCP is compassionate and my pain doc even more so.
If you really must know my private business-(if it will help) I am currently taking three 10-325 norcos or less a day. I am prescribed 90-120 depending on how i feel that month.
I honestly dont see why this matters but here is the info. i guess you cant reallly pm me as i dont know how to checj=k them. haha

Dr_Benway, thank you for posting that.

Leaving aside my total opposition to any legal control on access to narcotics and my belief people have the right to control their own bodies and what they place in it, that is the most sensible piece of legislation and policy I have seen in a long time from the UK. Do you know who was responsible for coming up with that policy? It would be nice for there to be an option to have a little faith in one of them that makes the Rules for a change.

Just curious, do you have children?

Flippie,
The story I heard was a patient came out of the office and drove into a mother and her kids crossing the street. They were soon shut down.
Mind you, I read this some where on a forum ,so don't know if it's true.
Sounds like Urban legend to me. It was in the UK and had a newspaper article attached. -Lucky

At one time I thought people whom took a lot of pain killers were full of [censored]] and just trying to get high. Then I fell off a building at work and I realize that if you are trying to get high there are easier ways to do it than to go through ALL the bullshit wuth the doctors! I am in severe pain now and cannot hardly get out of bed in the morning and a lot of times wish that I had not woke up in the first place because when I sleep I do not have to feel it. I recently considerd going to the ER and asking them if they could just put me out for about 3 days just so I can get some good sleep. I told a friend of mine and she said I was nuts! Also " they " the doctors tell me that I am fine and do not need anything. So, I am forced to get them other ways and can only afford a few because it is just too expensive. That is why I joimed this site. To see if I can find a better way to live. As if the pain was not enough I have to add stress to life as well. God bless ALL of you and if you can give me some tips on a " good " doctor it would be much appreciated.