Hi Straw! Good to see you.



i worry about this too sometimes, being a frequent user of the BZD's.

i can't give a scientific answer, but i can give a personal one if that means anything to you. my grandmother has taken 2mg lorazepam every night before bed for sleep for like decades. like even before my mom was born, and even confessed to me once she takes 'em during the day occasionally, even though she knows she is not supposed to, to help her get through her bad day. she does not have addiction issues, doesn't even drink or smoke. the cronic benzo usage doesn't seem to have negatively effected her at all. matter of fact, she is still just as mentally sharp and feisty in conversation like she always has been, and her recent visit to the doctor revealed she is in perfect health. the doc even remarked he was very surprised that a woman her age was in such good health as she is in her late 80's, and she's been taking Atavan nightly (and sometimes daily) for over forty plus years.

my guess is the answer to your question Straw is like so many other issues with psychoactives ... Your Milage Will Vary!

-Jen

When people get old, they often have difficulty sleeping. They tend to need less sleep anyway as they become less active. I would have no problem with someone in their 80s or whatever taking a hypnotic regularly, though short-acting ones are usually preferred as accumulation can occur, which must be monitored for initially. Dependence is not really an issue when someone does not have much life left.

Regarding physical damage to the body, probably none. But the current thinking is that long-term memory may be affected by long-term use, as well as the short-term memory problems we all know about. Re-dosing during the night creates more tolerance, and can establish a pattern of not sleeping due to expectation of re-dosing, or even waking up to re-dose.

Alcohol has some cross-tolerance to benzodiazepines and barbiturates because of the receptors they act on. Rather than looking for chemical similarities, just look at the receptors they act on.

The Z-drugs are supposed to activate specific GABA receptor sub-types, varying slightly from those activated by conventional benzodiazepines. Whether there is cross-tolerance between the two is not yet certain. Some patients report that they have tolerance to benzodiazepines, yet can take a normal dose of zopiclone and find it quite potent. As such, cross tolerance is certainly not complete, which means they cannot be substituted in benzodiazepine withdrawal.

I'm not married, but very difficult to catch.

Hang on, did Jennygirl say she was young and hot?

but my grammy didn't get prescribed the lorazepam because she was was getting old and having difficulty sleeping. she got it like back in the 1960's for night terrors. she was probably like in her thirties then. as you can probably guess, she soon realized it worked wonders for her anxiety and occasional insomnia. she even once told me it was a wonder drug for period pain?!? her doctor, who she went to until he retired a few years ago, had no qualms whatsoever at scripting out 2mg ativan to her whenever she ran out, no questions asked (wish i could find a doc like that!!!) the doctor actually ordered, yes ordered her to ALWAYS take one before bedtime every night. so, the point was that she has been taking a MINIMUM of 2mg lorazepam every 24hrs for like 45 some odd years, and still has excellent mental and physical health well into her old woman years. and shows no signs whatsoever of addictive behavior.



well, as we all know mileages vary and all the info isn't in yet on how brains work. but, at the very least, my grandmother's case proves that continuous long term use of benzos CAN be safe.



yes, i recently started having to do exactly that on some nights. redose the xanax halfway through the night in order to get back to sleep. very annoying to say the least, and a big red flag for dependence and other bad stuff. hence my reason for switching to valium (long half life) to treat my insomnia to eliminate my need to redose.



so are you saying that as a general rule, drugs that affect the same receptors in the CNS have a higher likelihood of being coss tolerant with each other? must it be the same general receptor, such as GABA, or a specific subunit of the receptor, such as GABA alpha one? IOW, would a drug that binds ONLY to GABA alpha one (but not at all to GABA alpha two) be cross tolerant to a drug that binds ONLY to GABA alpha two (but not at all to GABA alpha one)? sorry if this is a silly question, i'm just beginning to try and understand this pharmacology stuff.



well, it usually takes me at least 20mg (occasionally 30mg on a bad day) of zopiclone to make me sleep. any lower doses have no effects whatsoever in me. my cousin though, who is at least twice my size, has been a MAJOR alcoholic for 15 years, all the while popping lots of barbs and benzos like they were candy. as you know these are all GABA-centric drugs. but he can take a puny 5mg dose of zopiclone and fifteen minutes later he is like in a coma. every time. even if he is hyper when he takes it!



good men always are, whats your point? if you weren't difficult to catch i'd be worried. but i always get what i want. one way or the other.



hot? very much so. i hate to brag, but i really do get hit on ALL the time whenever i go out ANYWHERE day or night. drives my bf CRAZY. young, well, thats kinda in the eye of the beholder isn't it? to a high school boy, im kinda mrs robinson. to a thirty something, more like daddy's lil girl. how old do YOU think i am? how old ore you? not too old i hope, otherwise you'd never be able keep up with me.

-Jenny

Thank you Nephro and Jennygirl. Good information to know, I don't redose, but with ambiem Cr I don't need too, I just go with what sleep i can get. My Doc also gives me clonazepam, for Anixety. Maybe the anxiety come from when the ambien CR finally wears off. But I have not needed to up my dose on those in the year plus I have taken those.

Now as far as You and Jenny, would this be a good time to post your picture you put up 16 months ago? and then took down. Just kidding Nephro I will never post a picture, or even call you by your first name. As "Austin Powers" once said not even for a million dollars!

Thanks for your responce.

Strawberry, i think you are confusing me with someone else as i never posted a pic here. i have anxiety issues and one of them is getting busted by the drug cops for ordering the meds i so desperately need but my doctors/shrink is too spineless to prescribe on a regular basis ... a worry im sure alot of us have shared. in fact, im not even sure i have even been on DB for a whole 16mo.

thanks for your post tho, and it makes me happy to hear you have found a combo (ambien + clonazepam) that works for you! always a pleasure and an insightful experience to read your posts Strawbery, keep em coming!

Hi JennyGirl, I was refering to the pic Nephro put up of himself, a while back and removed quickley, not yours. Anyway I do hope that we all find the relief with Valium or which ever medication works. It was the valium for me for a while, but then turned out not to have much effect, the other meds Clonazepam, and Ambien Cr are actually used, (in my case) for two different things. As alway nice to hear from you too!

Anyone heard or tried this site?
http://www.world-drug.com/
Located in Panama
Lists Alprazolam, Bromazepam, Diazepam, Lorazepam, Rivottril and Tafil

Anyone take valium with hydrocodone? I'm taking hydrocodone for my back pain but i'm looking for a good muscle relaxer as well.Trust me i've tried the others,they either don't work or knock me out.

I do. Valium is the best muscle relaxer.

Thanks NBG,that's what i've heard.Problem is doctors don't seem to want to prescribe it.Or at least to me anyways.

Hi there,
Ambian CR and dizapam are a must for panic atttack- generalized anxiety- insomnia zombies. I too don't have a Dr. who helps; so I help myself. It's good to skip days'cause it seems like tolorance is sky high. Esp. for Ambien. Sometimes I'll take both for sleep. Good luck acting out your R.E.M.; and not panic sweating either.

(OOOO) Hugs,
Ms. Glutz

Yes Dear,
Dizapam, and kolodopin, anlong with codiene based meds. are wounderful for many maladies such as yours. Arthriits muscle spasms too. Soma works well for pain and spasms as well.
PEACE AND (0000) HUGS,
Barker Ranch Resident

Can anyone recommend a site for quality V’s?

Airsealed and rxvogue have good valiums also Offshorepharma.

Thanks Dodgers888

Hi

I'm having the worst time of my life - I wont go into details, but lots of really awful things have just happened all at once, and I want Valium to relieve my anxiety and shock, but unfortunately Valium usually turns me into a not very nice person, so I have considered trying Xanax.

I'm usually a pretty peaceful person but Valium makes me aggressive and I cant afford to be like that. Does anyone know if Xanax has the same effects of making some people aggressive?

What is best for Anxiety out of the two drugs, I have only ever taken Valium, never taken Xanax.

I looked for a thread about Xanax to post this in, but there's not one, and cant post new threads in this section, hope this is not too off topic.

R.

I have taken both and personally I like the Xanax better and it seems to help me more for the anxiety...The Valium just seems to make me tired, like my legs feel kind of weak (well, it is muscle relaxant) and it doesnt seem to do much for the anxiety...But everyone is different and reacts different to medications...

I wouldn't recommend xanax especially if you are in a bad state of mind. You will become dependent/addicted to it. It is way more addicting than Valium from my experience. I found myself increasing it from 1mg to 3mg very quickly, and the withdrawals are worse. I took Valium for a month and just stopped and i dint feel the withdrawal and dependence affects I had with xanax.

This may be off topic, but, if valium does not help you, then xanax is the wrong way to go, IMO.

not only can xanax make you more irritable, especially if valium does, but if you are having bad times, i believe it can make you more depressed.

I recently begin taking Valium, and it has really changed my life for the better! I am an extreme introvert, and now I can interact with others in a way I never thought I could. It works better than Zoloft, Effexor, Xanax, or anything else I ever tried.

It also helps with my RLS and insomnia. Different people react differently to medications, but this one has replaced three medications for me.

I hate shopping. I have been able to go the mall a couple of times since taking Valium. It also gives me the energy to clean house (which I hate!)

As always, it's a good idea to consult with your doctor before taking any medication. I just hope I don't build up a tolerance to it and it stops working.

The wrong does of Xanax and the wrong situation can make you very aggressive.

I won't into specific details of one of my life mistakes but it envolved about 4mg of xanax and about 3 beers. I saw a man hit a woman at a bar and well, I ended up wearing this mans blood. I completely blacked out as well and had to be filled on on what happened. Otherwise it has never ever even made me slightly aggressive or irritable. Now hydrocodone on the other hand makes me VERY irritable.

Thats good! Keep it up!...and good luck.

That's why The Rolling Stones called it, "Mother's Little Helper" and unbeknownst to many, is a derivative of genetically engineered Valerian root.

Wait i don't get it. Did the mom use it to get her kids to sleep?

No. Mother traded in her afternoon Martini for Valium while watching soap operas.

haha...so she basically went from a classy lady to a benzo lady.

NBG, Ithink it was in a Beatle's song instead of the rolling stones.
My doctor said it will do the job of ambian, Soma, and xanax with less side effects.
He wrote a script for 100 ct 5mg with one refill and said that should last 4 or 5 months.
Came out in the 60's and like asparin still one of the best meds to keep around
gabie

No, it was the Rolling Stones... I can still see Mick with those big lips singin'.....

What a drag it is getting old
Kids are different today,
I hear evry mother say
Mother needs something today to calm her down
And though shes not really ill
Theres a little yellow pill
She goes running for the shelter of a mothers little helper
And it helps her on her way, gets her through her busy day

mothers little helper was 5mg. valium but the real problem came when the doctors were handing out dexedrine like candy at the same time. Sent momma to the nuthouse.

Wow, bdit that is incredible! I haven't heard it help people with their energy levels that much. It just makes me tired.

I wish it helped me like this. What is your dosage if you don't mind me asking?

Oh and with the RLS, has it stopped it or just helped? I know someone with very bad RLS that has tried everything and maybe V's would help.