But you didn't get this doctor's name on your own. To me, getting a referral to a compassionate doctor who will treat you with dignity and respect is well worth the $150 difference. Calling, getting the name, and then making the appointment your self is sort of like the cheaty way of doing it (and I'm not saying you are doing this, that was a general statement). NNCIP went through the trouble and expense to put together this network of doctors. I would not expect them to skip compensation for their trouble and time.

I, for one, support NNCIP and want them to stay in business. It concerns me to hear that people would consider getting the information they want and then bypass going through them for the apt. Now that I have the doctor's name and address it would be simple for me to just cancel through them yet continue to see the doctor on my own. I wont do that out of principal as I truly appreciate the service they provided me with.

I'll comment briefly on this 'cause I'm getting a little OT, but no apology to me. Not for someone trying to obtain such "a large amount of narcotics" - 90 10/325's! The tech was obviously new, like 3 days old. Admittedly, I do arouse suspicion in a pharmacy if one doesn't look beyond physical appearance.

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I'm used to this routine. A couple of years back, my wife had some cysts removed at a relatively new one-day surgical center that had opened up. The Surgeon had an office, but for the 3 Rx's he issued post-sx, he had placed a label with the surgical center address over his office address on his Rx pads. This too was "illegal" when I brought my wife's Rx's to that same pharmacy.

I tried using logic. I explained the surgical center didn't open just yesterday and if the surgeon's Rx's were being rejected, certainly he would have invested in new pads ($20 a book on average). Still wouldn't budge. Then after careful scruity by all the pharm workers, someone noticed that on one of the 3 Rx's, an antibiotic, the Surgeon had left off the year (It was January - always a confusing time). So I was sent away empty handed for all 3 prescriptions. Despite the fact that I must have filled 100 Rx's there over time.

I almost became a "Drugstore Cowboy" that night, seeing how this is my wife we're talking about. Without going into details, I made sure my wife was comfortable. The kind surgeon was off the next day but I tracked him down on the golf course. The pharmacy had gone to the considerable trouble of leaving a message with his answering service, they told me.

BTW, this is the *best* pharmacy chain around here. They're #3, they try harder. Mom and Pops are long gone....

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Again, it just goes to show that there is suspicion in general with the recent "Hydro Madness" campaign in the news. She must have seen an Oprah episode.

One can do everything right and still run into nonsense.

Indeed, where I live, most seek serious medical care in NY. I'm in a "bedroom suburb" of NY. Most residents here work in NY. It was hardly an exotic prescription, like the prescribing physician was in Guam - I know from long firsthand experience of the NJ/NY reciprocity (though it may not work in NY from what I've been reading).

My mom who turned 76 yesterday has a theory. The Doctors who are 'A' students in med school practice in NY, the Doctors with 'B' averages come to NJ. The rest scatter around the country. Don't take offense, America! My mom has only visited about 4 US States in her lifetime.

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And while much discussion here goes on about where to bring an Rx, the bottom line is it depends mostly on the knowledge of the person behind the counter.

Sorry for the OT!

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Back to NNCIP. Fairy made some excellent points. Those who want to 'get over' on NNCIP and bypass their referral fees are part of the reason the OCS industry is in such disarray. Many of the OCS operators and pharmacies did their share to add a 'seediness' to the whole thing.

In my innocence, I was stunned to read about what some "patients" do to fool OCS's. I'll leave out the sordid details, but you know what I'm speaking of.

Similarly, so many OCS's had very short term "business plans", to put it mildly.

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Andrew, the CEO of NNCIP, is dead serious about this being a long-term solution for the Chronic Pain patient. I've had conversations and correspondence with him and NNCIP will be around in 20 years, I predict.

For instance, the NY facility opening was delayed until Andrew could fly to NY in order to do a "walkthrough" of the very impressive, long operational center that has signed up with NNCIP. No doubt he had a long checklist of items required to meet NNCIP standards.

I probably shouldn't be saying all this, but for the doubters, Doctors are more comfortable treating a Chronic Pain patient who has been vetted by an admittedly for-profit organization that ensures that "drug seekers" are not going to ruin things. I predict others will follow this lead and they'll be hope for the Chronic Pain (and Anxiety Disorder) patient even if SB 980 becomes the law of the land.

For those who want to sneak in the back door, I'll bet you'll be sorely disappointed. I was taken seriously, will you? I received a comprehensive examination that astounded me. Good thing I wore clean clothes! (though they were sweatpants and a t-shirt - I can't wear "regular" pants without pain). Also received reams of excellent advice from a Doctor who really cared. The bottom line is that the Doctor who runs this comprensive facility doesn't just sit there writing prescriptions. They treat a myriad of medical problems, some happen to be accompanied by severe pain.

Become a VIP instead and you'll save considerably that way. BTW, there is no spot on the registration form that I could see for the VIP discount. I called CS and it was applied.

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I do not work for NNCIP or receive any special favors for suggestions that I've made. I'm simply a patient and nothing more. The name drugbuyers.com never came up during my consultation. Nor did I mention having done anything except filling out the registration. It was co-incidence that I was NY patient #1. I just take a keen interest in any option that will keep the Chronic Pain patient out of pain.

Folks have to stop being suspicious of anything that comes along that might be in our best interests. Cautious yes, but we can't rule out an option just because we perceive a "workaround" that frankly, probably won't get you serviced.

It's understandable considering how much disappointment and broken promises we've endured, especially of late.

Give them a shot - or:

1) Wait on some OCS to finally get a pharmacy that will fill your long overdue Rx. Pray the site will be up tomorrow.

2) Wander from pharmacy to pharmacy with some Direct script written by a Doctor you never even spoke to.

3) Send cash or a blank MO Fedex to an address sent to you via email and hope for the best while paying $10.00 a pill.

I don't blame folks for doing those things --- you can't put a price on relief from intractable pain, but consider the options now that there are some.

patient2all

Actually NNCIP did give me the doctors name and I called his office myself and asked exactly what he charged for an office visit. So, what are they providing extra that I cant get for cheaper just going to this NP Doc?

just gotta hope NNCIP learned something from your sneaky behavior. if they are going to give out the doc's names, they won't have a company that makes any money at all.

clever on your part, not so smart on their part.

are you going to bypass nncip and go to the doc on your own? perhaps you will walk away with an rx for ibuprofen and flexeril. just desserts.

a sense of fairness, honesty, character, and decency maybe?

A ND is a naturalpathic doctor who cannot and would not prescribe any prescription meds. A NP is a nurse practioner and they can prescribe meds. If they are doing narcotics they must have their own dea license. Most clear the patient for MD and the MD prescribes the narcs. You will never get legal narcotics from a ND

Mail, They are a referral service and they referred you to a particular doctor. That is what you are paying for. Where would you be without the doctors name that THEY gave you?? You don't get that? The doctor will drop you like a hot potato if/when they find out that you found them through NNCIP and then diverted around them to go directly to the doctor. I really have a hard time understanding why you would even think of doing that. I'm sure that NNCIP does have a way to check to see if someone that signed up with them and then never did follow through is being seen by THEIR doctor. All they have to do is call that doctor.

I use NNCIP and found them to be a super customer oriented company and I never would have even known about this doctor if it weren't for them and for that I am grateful and will gladly pay them for it.

Please don't try to tell us that you would have found that doctor on your own because you know and all of us know that it's not that easy. I know there is no way in heck I would have found the doctor that NNCIP found for me. Through NNCIP I pay just $99 per month (with the DB.com VIP code)and $15 for my meds. Without them I would still be on the OCS rollercoaster, waiting and waiting for my meds to ship.

My life has been soooo less stressful since I found them.

This is JMHO but one I feel very strongly about. I hope you come to your senses and not follow through on seeing this doctor on your own. I am not trying to flame you here but instead hope to just make you understand that it would just be wrong to go that route.

Everyone Loves NNCIP! Sorry, I had to do it.

BBM

One more thing...I'm sure it is not the norm that they give out the doctors name before someone actually sends in their records and accepts their terms to work with them. I would assume that it was just an innocent/naive mistake that one of their customer service people made.

BBM,

I agree with all that you said and then some.

Beyond just being a referral service, this is a concept that I believe took a lot of investment and has exceptionally strong potential to be the sort of service that others will emulate in the future to serve a population that is becoming too huge to ignore.

The Doctors are operating under the aegis of an admittedly for-profit corporation that is attempting to properly and legally take care of the needs of an ever-aging population that deserves better than to be taken down the feelfreedom road. (Did I say something like this already, speaking of the "ever aging"? ).

My strong impression is that more thought and investment went into NNCIP than just finding Doctors and telling them we'll pay you $15.00 for every Rx our P/A's send your way. While so far, NNCIP appears to only be utilizing Medical Doctors for consults and exams, they do allow for some limited involvement of P/A's under the strictest guidance.

In the entirely short-term motivated ROP industry, I'd venture that much of the time patients were unsure if they had just consulted with a Doctor, a P/A, or in the most egregious cases which really hurt the industry, someone totally medically untrained.

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I honestly believe we're finally seeing what could have been and what should have been from the early years when medicine became mixed with the Internet. It was a logical concept, but rarely done right.

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It's become painfully and publically apparent that anyone can start an OCS from an apartment and a UPS MailBox and the cheapest 1 year hosting package available. In fact, some services of late omit the expense of a telephone! Especially with the prevalance of direct scripts, you don't even need a pharmacy, only a willing Doctor (we assume a Doctor in some cases...). Oh, and I forgot the OCS operator needs a nickname too, perhaps several if they operate more than one site.

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I'm sure, in fact I know, that a lot goes on behind the scenes in setting up an NNCIP contract just right so it's sustainable over the long term. It's actually fulfilling a need we used to take for granted that gradually disappeared over the last decade or two.

Thirty years ago, there were Doctors in independent practice who treated any number of ailments. Some of those ailments may have been painful. In that event, a Doctor would not hesitate to prescribe adequate pain medication without fears of writing too many controlled prescriptions.

Now it's all about managed care and potential liability and fears of the DEA if it got out that a Doctor was "too loose" with the pad, whether it be out of medical concern or something more nefarious.

I literally had a Doctor who wanted to treat her patients adequately with compassion but was stymied by the head of the practice who put paltry limits on the amounts that could be prescribed. A patient's medical needs did not factor into the equation whatsoever.

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The fact is that it appears that the facilities NNCIP contracts with are more than just "scriptwriters" and needn't worry about "1.5 million diverted dosage units" turning up in some show/cause order.

They do more than just write prescriptions and I'm taking a leap here, but I would not be surprised if NNCIP helps the brave Doctors it contracts with some underwriting of liability insurance, among other benefits and assurances. Plus their insistance on quality control at NNCIP facility distinguishes NCCIP from the OCS world.

This is not simply a newly painted OCS.

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The typical moribund OCS if often simply looking for a Doctor, any Doctor and perhaps a pharmacy, any pharmacy. Several OCS's have enlisted their patients to seek out willing pharmacies. I recall one had a parting line in their "script" for any "cold called" pharmacy who balked at turning down this "golden opportunity" -- "Okay, but keep my phone number for when you can't pay the electric bill anymore..."

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While over the years, I've had the good fortune to have gone (mostly) with OCS's that utilized pioneering, dedicated Doctors with clean records, I have checked out some other Doctors working with OCS's and it's readily apparent how this became a job of last resort for them.

Check out some of these OCS Doctors on their respective state Boards of Medicine and you'll see they've "elected not to carry medical malpractice insurance" among other inadequacies.

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There is power in numbers and corporate backing that resides in a real office building and the more forethought, screening and planning that goes into an endeavor like NNCIP increases the likelyhood that the website will be there next month for you.

Despite the relative confidence that the Doctors have in their patients, their Doctors are brave and iconoclastic in today's medical climate to consider opiate therapy at all. In fairness, the same can be said for some Doctors working for OCSs currently too.

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Consider how many Doctors most of us have visited who acknowlege our conditions and resulting pain or anxiety, but work for practices that simply that take the easiest road and refuse to prescribe any controlled substance.

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Okay, BBM, I think you're a little wrong on that one -- only based on my own experience. Shortly after startup, when they first offered me a Doctor within range, the invitation contained the full Doctor's information, name, address and qualifications. While the Doctor was within NNCIP's travelling guidelines, it was too far for my back's driving guidelines, I felt

The only advantage would have been that by the time I crawled out of my car at the Doctor's office, I would have likely gotten the maximum dosage permissible after my examination

Since a closer area was becoming bluer and bluer, I decided to hold out a month. I'm glad I did. However, this time I didn't get the Doctor's practice location until everything was finalized.

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So I suspect that was simply a trusting company policy that the Doctor's name and address wouldn't be passed around like the latest "pill mill" to open up in a dark corner office somewhere.

A patient is being naive if they think they can walk in without a referral or any vetting of their records and identity. I believe my PCP may have been called, but not sure. I told NNCIP, I'd be proud for them to call that joker and identify themselves! The NNCIP Doctor had made a remark that he knew all about me already through the "miracle of modern computing" or similar. Admittedly, I may have misinterpreted that.

So those who think they can pass the Doctor's name around like it was some "secret source" are likely to be disappointed.

Folks read this board looking for that "secret source" all the time. I can tell you how to save, I believe $145.00 a year, on NCCIP's service -- become a VIP

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After all, most of us here had exhausted all local options, paid our money and not achieved regular, compassionate pain relief or attention. Even if NNCIP is "just a referral service", how long would it have taken you to find a Doctor attentive beyond belief and compassionate toward your pain issues on your own? The complex I visited was a megaplex among megaplexes of Doctors. I wonder how many doors I could have knocked on before receiving real, "old time", unrushed, medical treatment.

This month, I saw my PCP who spent about 45 seconds with me and will send a bill. Today I saw an ortho surgeon who spent under 10 minutes with me. NNCIP's Doctor spent between an hour and an hour and a half with me.

I'm not talking to any poster in particular, but why try to ruin the one viable and legal option the Chronic Pain or Anxiety patient in the belief you'll be saving yourself a few bucks?

patient2all

P2A,

Very well said! As usual, you have a way with words. The NNCIP rep did reply to this same poster on a Questions thread saying that they do wait until they either have the records or that someone had signed up on their site (I can't remember which it was) but either way it shows some kind of committment before releasing the name of the doctor. They also went on to say, as I had assumed in my post above, that they do have systems in place to be able to know if someone has tried to go around them and go directly to the doctor.

Also P2A, had you signed up on their site or sent your records prior to them giving you the doctors information? Just curious. I would also not be surprised if they had their doctors call them when they happen to get a brand new patient walk in without any kind of referral, just to see if NNCIP has any record of them contacting them.

In any case, they have obviously done their homework and I believe they will be around for a long time. At least I hope so.

Have a great evening!

BBM

Hi,

I love NNCIP too! I was just reading around the OCS threads and sighing with relief. I just put in for my refill with NNCIP. I did it over the phone and they called it in. The whole process was so painless. Such a refreshing start.I think I had my meds before they even charged my card. Jaimie is wonderful too. I think this is the sappiest post I have ever written. I'm in love! I'm just crossing my fingers it stays this way until there is a cure for pain.

I had so much anxiety over my medicine in the past, it really is the last thing someone with CP needs, it just seems like thats all we get sometimes. Are they having delays? Did they send it to the pharmacy? Why did that person receive and not me? Where is Fed-ex? Are they all here? Are they a good brand? Did their prices go up? will it be here on time? ARGHHHHHHHH..... Not having to go thru the OCS maze every month is well worth any amount of money. Plus I actually liked the DR. I felt better having a F2F. It's just better, for me.

Does anybody know if NNCIP has a Dr's in Washington State? I have been looking online for a non-shady OCS but this seems like the most legit.

go to their website , it has a button that says click HERE to see dr. and what states are active. if they have one in your state i would highly recommend this route as it is legit and reliable. they also have the best customer service i have ever dealt with and that includes the brick and mortor dr 's i have seen

Is there anyone that has used this service in OR? I would like to know what the experience was like before I spend so much money.

Dear Mail:

I saw the doctor in Illinois and absolutely love her!Anyone who lives in a state that has a provider should consider this route, especially with all the problems in the OCS world right now. However, I really understand the unwillingness to go to yet another doctor who either tells you that you are crazy, a drug seeker or to just live with the pain and then write for Ibuprofen. Seeing yet another physician can be a daunting task. However, those of us who have taken the plunge just want to reassure those who might be thinking of making an appointment that it has been a relatively simple and straightforward process. I guess some folks are just more comfortable with the OCS model. I fear that the OCS model as it now functions will soon be a thing of the past; this is the main reason I chose to go this route. The delays, high prices, etc. helped make that leap as well. I am just so very fortunate that there is a doctor in my state. If you have one in your state I couldn't endorse seeing them more. Good Luck Mail, I hope it works out for you.

There are pain management sources around, but the problem is you have to have a referral. And that referral seems impossible because it's the uncaring "ibuprophen writers" doctors who have to facilitate that referral.

Does anyone know of any other way?

Has anyone visited the Texas Dr. recently and, if so, what kind of feedback can you provide?

I saw the Texas doctor at the end of last month. It went smoothly and he called in my meds that day. It was a good experience.

Thank you.

i recently went back to using the texas dr. at nncip after having been in a pain management program thruogh a local clinic. the local pm dr. put me thruogh so many shots, epidurals, facet point injections or nerve blocks that it made me sick and drained my pocket book with very little and very short term relief.

anyone that thinks nncip is expensive should sign up for the shots with a pm practice , try $3500.00 for about two days relief a week. i know, the shots work for some , but they didn't for me.

the tx dr. has been diligent and caring about my medical issues . i'm very happy with the quality of care he has provided and the cost savings of using this service thruogh nncip.

mind you , this service is for people with legitimate pain conditions that can be documented with the appropriate mri's and medical records. but all in all he is easy to talk with and understanding of the chronic pain patient and what we have to go thruogh to find control of the condition.

i highly recommend this service ,53chevy

I agree! These folks always answer calls and emails and try to fix any problem that comes up. I can not say enough about them. It is worth the fees.

Anyone recently visited the AZ doc's, particularly in Phoenix area?

And what is the status of the Tucson provider? Is he an MD, or solely focused on naturopathic remedies?

Thanks

Anyone see the CA doc?

anyone with a review and/or experience with the Oregon ND?

Hi~

Since TN doesn't have a doctor through NNCIP, does anyone know if they will allow you to drive to a bordering state, i.e. Georgia?

I will gladly travel there as I have driven alot further than there for other occasions and don't mind the drive at all.

Thanks for any information and have a pain free day,
Sitara

If your within their milage limit, they might allow you to travel. I was not able to do so as I am a bordering state but too many miles away.

Hi ,
Just wanted to keep everyone updated. Still with NNCIP. Everything is going as planned. I had my phone consult at 3 mos and it was absolutely painless! Everytime I call for a refill it is at the pharmacy in less than 2 hours. It really has been a great stress reducer in my life!

I'm in GA and its all going well here!
Jane

I LOVE THESE FOLKS!!!

consistent, polite, responds to calls/emails, straight forward no jerking you around, and truly/deeply care about there customers and there customers needs!!!!!!

A++++++++++++

*****WORTH EVERY PENNY*********

Has anyone had any experience with the Elizabeth, NJ doctor? I have an appt. on Monday and was wondering if anyone has tried them yet. Let me know your experience. Thanks.

I will go ahead and answer my own post, LOL. I just saw the Elizabeth doctor and am very happy for the following reasons:

1) I had a 3 PM appt., and happened to get there early at 2:30 and saw the doctor within 15 minutes, no waiting. The nurse took my vitals and the reason for my visit and then the doctor walked in a couple minutes later.

2) He was very nice and compassionate and answered all my questions.

3) I was worried about whether I would get an Rx for oxycodone which is preferred since this is what my records say I have been getting on a regular basis. Also, I was worried about getting the right dosage since I have a tolerance to opiods and needed a dosage increase. I am always unsure if a new doctor is willing to increase the dosage as soon as you see them. I figured I might have to settle for hydrocodone since you can call it in to a pharmacy and put refills on it as opposed to oxycodone (Schedule II) which needs a new paper Rx each time in NJ. Luckily, the doctor prescribed oxycodone 30mg 3x per day when I was previously getting oxycodone 15mg 4x per day. So, I not only got the medication I needed, but also the dosage increase that was needed as well.

All in all, I am very pleased with the experience so far. Now I just have to see how the phone consults and refills go each month. I'll post about this as well in a month or two.

Anyone seen the NNCIP doc in Phoenix? Please send me a PM as I'd like to know if your experiences varied significantly from mine. I may be slow to respond - I'm having intermittent problems with my internet connection at home.

I saw the Phoenix physician recently and it was a bit disappointing. Just curious of how others rated the care.

Thanks,

Sam

disappointing how exactly. i use nncip's dr. in another state and am satisfied with rthe care i recieve. please tell us more.