Was/is your good friend allowed to "set the record straight"? Or somehow get someone to do that? I mean, really someone who knows the truth about Ryan Haight should speak up LOUD because this bill looming on becoming law is based on lies!

Good Post MoodyBlue! Particularly item 7 of the "Additional Requirements" part of the bill:

`(7) The following statement, unless revised by the Attorney General by regulation: `This online pharmacy will only dispense a controlled substance to a person who has a valid prescription issued for a legitimate medical purpose based upon a medical relationship with a prescribing practitioner. This includes at least one prior in-person medical evaluation or medical evaluation via telemedicine in accordance with applicable requirements of section 309 of the Controlled Substances Act (21 U.S.C. 829).'.

Obviously any measure that saves lifes and protects kids is going to be a good and popular cause... but will the "Ryan Haight Online Consumer Protection Act" help do that?

How would that law change things for TriStateHealthPartners.net, Direct-scripts.net, Chatcp.com, our info site, IOP's like Todofarmacia.com, or the blatantly illegal sites like feelfreedom.org?

The operators of feelfreedom.org also operate sites like fillinghealthy.com and silencehealth.com and secretproducts.net just to name a few.

You know? Ruggie makes an excellent point - this bill is about pharmaciesnot Online Consult Services (OCS) which is most likely the reason so many OCS are turning to Direct Script Services. And if that is the case, the direct script only OCS have nothing to worry about. It is unfortunate however for the OCS that do both or only traditional consulting using pharmacies. I'm sure the legals are not going to stop there either. One way or another, they will halt all OCS sooner than later. jmo

Laws like this one have made it increasingly difficult for legitimate patients to utilize the services of Online Consulting Services and pharmacies - let alone the people who are not and abuse the systems. So, I am sure these type of bills/laws have helped curb some of the illegal activity. Look back a few years - there were quite a few NROP's where you could buy hydrocodone for instance, quite easily actually. Which is where I am sure most of the kids were able to obtain things with a click of the mouse (as reported). Today, that is not true - which has saved many lives I am sure. The problem is that law makers, congress people and many parents are confused that ALL OCS are the same and therefore trying to stop every one of them from operating. In my opinion, that action is not going to help keep kids drug free and alive. Education, parent involvment, school involvment etc is what is going to help our children.

Ryan's mother and the Ryan's Cause folks don't want to hear how little Ryan was really a junkie, he was NOT inexperienced in opiates at all.

The kid had a credit card, his parents obviously never checked it. Never checked the packages he was getting, and had no idea their son was out 'raving' and tripping.

They claim it was a total shock and these big mean drug dealers just randomly sent drugs to him, and Ryan must have just clicked and had them sent.

This was back in the day of the DolphinRX days and TropicalRX...etc..
BUT...Ryans parents were clueless about their son's drug usage.

It wasn't the hydro he got from a pharmacy online that killed him.

I'm so sick of hearing her 'Internet Nightmare Story' and how the perfect family lost their perfect son.
How about making a Foundation for parents to KNOW WHAT THE HECK THEIR KIDS ARE DOING???

admin, you forgot UMEDSONLINE which is every bit as illegal as FF.

Not true. This Bill will effect the DS places as well as ROPS using fulfillment pharmacies. While the Bill may not specifically make the OCS itself "illegal" it will make it impossible to contract the Doctors who now write for them, unless they can schedule a face to face meeting between their customers and their contracted physicians. The DS sites still issue prescriptions for controlled substances without a physical face to face with the prescribing Physician. Their prescriptions will also be illegal. Period. Only the new service, NNCIP will be exempt as they DO require a F2F at least once a year with their Doctor.

Why, once S 980 is put into law, umeds will be an excellent place for rich, underage kids to get prescription medication for "kicks".

That's all that will be left, places way beyond the reach of regulators. Places that don't have to worry about pesky laws.

----
We've reported it before, but this is the accurate account or Ryan Haight, a little different than what the current media reports.

----


Quote:


Quicksilver was his screen name on the ugly board where his "skills" were honed.

A couple of quotes from the time to put things in context:


Quote:
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what exactly happened to ryan?
i guess i mean how did he mess up?

As best we know - he injected an unknown amount of morphine, fell unconscious and possibly choked on his vomit - we don't have any definitive answers, but thats what was pieced together (none of it can be confirmed at this point) .. there is a chance he lapsed into respiratory apnea, but that would take a fairly large amount of morphine to accomplish...
Again, that is what we believe happend based upon the testimony of those who had talked to him in his last hours... all we are certin of is that he had been taking narcotics (hydrocodone and morphine) - he had made a number of comments about injecting it, and had even had a lengthy discussion with me about the technicalities of it...



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Quote:
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Online, Ryan's death was met with disbelief. "I considered Ryan to be the most experienced and wise person I know when it came to drugs . . . I was so incredibly shocked," wrote ZeroHawk. And from beyond the grave came Ryan's own account of one of his last trips, sent in an e-mail started at 10:28 p.m. on Feb. 10, 2001. He had taken drugs he had received "in the mail that day," grabbed a Sprite and ice and wrote of "the little whirlpools of color moving all over. Not TOO much to handle. They were PERFECT."


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I hate repeating the facts surrounding the sad demise of a young adult (I believe he was 18), but the truth has been so distorted over the past 7 years since this tragic event.

People * must * hear more about us!

I see Stars if I try to lift anything over 10 pounds. That's when I'm well enough to try that.....

May g-d rest his soul

patient2all

Excellent point tigersmom! You are very correct, but didn't Madison Pain Clinic require F2F visits? What is NNCIP doing that MPC didn't? Anyone know?

P2all - I wonder WHY places like this are "out of reach" or above the law?? How is it they can stay in business without worry? I just don't get it.

and just to comment on the Ryan Haight incident: I do care that he died. I am sad for his family, but for his parents and supporters to zero in on only the internet - namely the legit OCS places is just wrong. I wonder if his parents et al were given a report of these words he himself wrote on this ugly website (not DB)?? Do they not care or were they advised by lawmakers and lawyers that the best the government can do is to go after legit online medicine? This whole story is tragic, not just Ryan's death but what is happening (wrongly so) to the OCS world because of it when it clearly happened otherwise than they are claiming!!

I find it disturbing that this bill is being sold to congress based off this kids tragic story. The president touts this bill as saving our children from drugs. Whos not going to vote on that? What about us adults who can make educated decisions for ourselves? "Ryan Haight" is a cover story to impose more restrictions on our lives.
Unfortunatley in this day most people dont take responsibility for there actions/in actions and when something bad happens they point the finger at everybody but themselves. In there attempts to make themselves feel better they can negatively affect the lives of countless other people.

Please people email your Senators and congressmen urging them to Vote NO on S980 at the link provided by hillgirl upthread. If anyone wants to see a copy of the emails I sent to mine, feel free to PM me. You are welcome to copy it, and use it if you wish etc.

I wondered where ruggie was coming from in implying that I had confused the pharmacies with the OCS, I simply made a mistake, I was indeed thinking of the OCS themselves.

Hi All -

I did not know S.980 had cleared the Senate on April 1st, so thanks for that update. I see that it has dual committee referral in the House: Energy and Commerce and Judiciary.

Citizens can call the E&C Committee (202) 225-2927 and the Judiciary Committee (202) 225-3951 to register concerns about the bill. Ask to speak to (or leave a message with) the Committee staffer handling the "Ryan Haight Online Consumer Protection Act" (S980) which cleared the Senate and has been referred to their Committee. Tell them you think there should at least be further hearings before House action on the bill, and it should NOT move to the House floor on unanimous consent (UC).

I'll post anything I find out about the two Committees' intent regarding this legislation, and would appreciate any new info on this from anyone else who is following it. Thanks!

Best, - HG

I am with you on this fangz.

google ryan haight + quicksilver man all they talk about is how they would get high with each other and how ryan could not walk one day after snorting 30mgs of some medication.

see? this is exactly the kind of stuff his parents et al, need to be reading. Not that it would make a dang difference now.

What kind of parents give their kids a debit/credit card and don't notice high dollar amount purchases being made off the internet? I think I read somewhere that they thought he was buying baseball cards. Give me a break. None of these companies seem real discret when it comes to what shows up on the credit card statement. (Meds4U $312.00) Like that wouldn't clue the parents in. I got a $20 bill every week and had to account for what I spent it on. I wonder if this kid had died from alcohol poisioning after buying wine off the internet if the government would be bringing back Prohibition. Plus all this is going to do is make people do more nefarious things to get pain relief.

Does anyone who understands our legislative process have an
idea how long we are looking at until this becomes LAW?!!

I can't believe there aren't pages and pages of posts about
this!! Is it because many don't realize just how major and
emminent this is? ( I will be e-mailing my congressmen...
for what its worth)

How exactly does one accidentally snort something? Was he smelling the fresh air a little too close to a line of this stuff and he just smelled to strong and it flew up his nose?

He didn't really know the record. He was contacted by a female DEA agent who wanted to question him about Ryan's death. They apparently found a package with his return address on it and wanted to know if he sent him the drugs. However, what he actually had sent him was the afforementioned, and at the time legal, drug known as 2C-T-7. So he agreed to meet with the agent for lunch and the matter was dropped. I heard the real story from a couple of his closer friends, but I haven't had any contact with them for several years now.

Since the introduction of SB 980 and two similar bills, we've had numerous threads urging activism efforts.

In fact, since the "lower" part of the board gets so few views, I had taken to opening threads in "Open Discussion".

All of us who have a stake in this are open to ideas. I've written articles, but our plight isn't taken seriously by the still healthy American public. We have as much credibility as the "Legalize MJ" movements in most peoples' eyes.

Oddly, Ryan Haight's favorite board is still out there and thriving. I did some wild things when I was much younger, but it never occurred to me to go into my chemistry set to try to get a buzz!

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The DEA has already done a pretty good pre-reconnicense job on decimating any former viable, compliant OCS. The current crop of OCS's, by and large, are a bunch of clowns. With few exceptions, they're a little hard to defend of late....
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nncip is making a serious valid effort to forge a future for us. Their success, if it happens, will spawn imitators of their model (which has little to do with what MPC was about).

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In the meantime, we can give it our best shot, but frankly it doesn't look good for us.

Never thought I'd be saying that.

patient2all

You hit the nail on the head. All the laws in the world won't matter if somebody wants to get their fix and they never will.

There needs to be a meeting of the minds between the law and common sense. I'm sure it won't happen in our time, but it's a beautiful vision for the far off future.......

And if you notice, different media stories about Ryan will tell a different age/medication/sob story depending on how they want to slant the story.

Some say he was 15, some 17, he was ordering Oxy over the internet with just a click...by accident, his parents knew everything their lovely child did...the computer was in the family room.
It goes on and on.
I've made numerous posts about this over the years.


I feel bad whenever a young person dies. BUT, HAD HIS PARENTS TAKEN SOME RESPONSIBILITY, I think it wouldn't be so bad in my mind.

That website Ryan visited and had many real life friends from is still up, still going. They have memorialized "QuickSilver".

My point on all this is the sites that Ryan used to get the Narcotics are all gone now. Their job is done. There are no more.

Those of us around in those days remember those sites, right?

Now, it's almost harder to get meds from an OCS referral system than at your local doctor.
Good grief, if a kid is going to OD on 10mg codeine from an IOP, then jeez...we have a problem.

But, my bigger point I've always had with the "Ryans Cause" foundation is ...HIS PARENTS HAD NO DANG IDEA WHAT THEIR SON WAS DOING.
This kid was a raver, hard core.
He had a damn credit card. He was young enough his parents should have checked the statement.
The excuse that they "Thought he was buying baseball cards" just doesn't fly with me.
If he were buying guns and ammo, would they use that excuse when he shot up a school?

Well, hell, I THOUGHT my kid was working on her Nobel Peace Prize speech.
You thought your kid took a bath?
You thought your kid ate dinner?
WTH??


(I have some personal stock in situations like this, my 15 year old nephew shot himself after YEARS and YEARS of vicious fighting with his mother and numerous boyfriends of hers.
After he dies, his mother goes on the "we were the PERFECT FAMILY and had the PERFECT HOME" speil so everyone who didn't know the inside story felt sorry for her and it helped ease her guilt *to the outside world*)

This Ryan kid had a computer in his room, an open credit card, access to money, parties, friends who helped him trip, etc...the parents had him out of their way to do whatever they did in the evenings to NOT know what he was doing.


Notice the comments section on Ryan's Cause website is down. They couldn't stop the people who weren't all "I'm soooo sorry and we must put an end to these big bad pharmacies who made your kid take their products"

This shouldn't have a darn thing to do with chronic pain sufferers, but it does. And all we can do is write letters and try and be heard.

I found this quote on an "About Ryan" page:

"Ryan loved using the computer. He was thrilled to find out that he could easily chat Online with his friends from school. He soon learned that he could chat with other kids across the country that were his age and had the same interests as he did. He could send and receive email everyday. He could enter chat rooms and talk about educational and current events. He learned to surf the Internet and quickly learned their was so much information that was so easy to get. It was a perfect place for him to use for his papers in school, or to seek information he was curious about. Ryan used the computer to play games against his friends, to compete in Fantasy Baseball where you choose your teams. He loved to trade baseball cards on Ebay. Ryan was taking a computer graphics class in high school. He was considering a possible career with computers."

Yeah, he did seem to like to chat, I really doubt it was about educational issues however.

So he died in 2001. I haven't heard of any other teenagers dying from meds they received from evil internet drug dealers. I know of 3 local twenty-year olds who died from methadone that was obtained from the local methadone clinic. I don't see how telemedicine is even that big of a deal. As many statistics show, most young people are getting the meds from the family medicine cabinet.

You know what you're talking about then. Doesn't it irritate you that you know a major portion of the truth but you can't get it out to the media?

I bet even if you wrote your experience up and paralleled it with Haight's, it wouldn't get published. Truth is far stranger than fiction and the media turns everything into semi-palatable mush and force feeds it down people's throats. If they feed the public garbage long enough, people just start to accept it. Most myths start from a grain of truth.

What we read and see and hear is controlled, but by whom? As long as we keep watching TV and reading the cr*p designed to scare, titillate, desensitize and manipulate, they'll keep on giving us the same garbage.

I just look at the obits in the daily paper any more. If I'm not in there, it's a good day. The rest of like eating Kleenex.

IMO the Gov't should focus on regulating the OCS's, I am sure the legit OCS's would be more than wiling to do what they need if they would just put a set of regulations in place and something in place to stop anyone from multi sourcing with OCS's, JMO.

Agreed. Set up the Rules and go from there, instead of all this dikking around. Then everyone would know where they stand.

It's the not knowing and the "vagueness" that drives everybody nuts.